Jackson, having lived in Madison, I can tell you why I do not live there anymore. No parking, Very poor snow removal. 300 people getting arrested at a block party. Having to endure the smell of hippies that don't bathe. People relieving themselves in my front yard on numerous occasions. Being hassled by every left wing group of losers with their idiotic agenda pounding on my door looking for a signature. Putting up with the guy next door playing his bongo drums while he gets stoned and thinks its a higher art form. Being lectured by neighbors about my vehicle of choice, and the general widespread intolerance in that narrow-minded town. You like it so much? You go and live their. Oh, and your references to a fat pig millionaire that makes his money telling half truths, pandering to idiots,and victimizing people in unfortunate situations is just pathetic. Maybe you and Michael Moore can go to Venezuela and crawl in bed with Hugo Chavez. I'm sure you are all of the same mind.

Jackson,

You said "Sorry man people have to go to Madison, and Rockford to find good things". Wow, you are more of a Neanderthal than I thought. What good things are in Madison or Rockford? You have to go to Chicago to find anything decent. Of course, that is why I got the hell out of dodge instead of continuing to live there and just whine. The energy you use whining about GM and Janesville could be used to study so you can get a degree and get out of the town you loathe. And don’t use the excuse that you are not bright enough for a degree. Every big city needs ditch diggers too!

There is no joy here. I am just sick of the Tax payer pick up the tab for these suckers. When you drive down the local street take a look at how many Asian cars of high value are here.I know you must wear ear plugs, and blinders when you ever leave Janesville, and speak of GM. I beat if you took a poll in this town, of what people think of GM works you would be shocked.

Don't feed the troll. Ignore them and they go away.

Come on folks we all know a Jackson...
they are the ones who stand around AFTER something happens and then become the town cryer...
I told you, I told you, I told you.
They way that you take joy in the fact that so many lives will be affected shows your true face.

Jackson - When you say 'they' say GM and lazy workers... who are you refering to as 'they' or are you just saying you call them lazy workers and such?

Sorry man I did not know you do not like the truth. I am speaking about serious issues, and the impressions people from other areas feel about GM. When you say Janesville they do not say KKK, four ward, downtown is dead, BUT THEY SAY GM, AND LAZY WORKERS. If you do not believe me crawl out from under that rock.

To Jackson, et al: Do you know what the definition of a Troll is, as it pertains to forum posts? It is "To deliberately post derogatory or inflammatory comments to a community forum, chat room, newsgroup and/or a blog in order to bait other users into responding."
It is easily seen when repeated, similar, derogatory, inflaming comments are posted about a single group of people (“Janesville has been seen with a dark image from GM, and there people") over and over again without one bit of useful dialogue. Trolling is widely believed to be associated with masculinity issues.

Sorry man people have to go to Madison, and Rockford to find good things. Why? Because Janesville has been seen with a dark image from GM, and there people. All that will build here are 5 new taco stands, and burger worlds. There is no fine dining, or even new stores in the malls.Remember two years ago the City told residents that Lowes was coming to town to employ 1000 works over two years. They came hired 30 found the labor pool sucked, and decided on Rockford. Beloit has more going for it than Janesville.

With all the new about GM I hope all of you stop and think. We have heard your voices on buying American and support American workers. Well that works locally also. The next time your out looking for a product or service remember think local not chain. Hard working friends and family need it. Dont throw the stone when you eat at chains, shop at chains and drive to madison/ Rockford for services, Its all right here janesville support our own

I remember waiting in lines at the gas pump in November 2001. Talk then was that we were going to run out of oil/gas, etc. and to stock up NOW. Kind of a moot point as most people only buy enough to fill their tank and maybe a 5 gallon gas can for lawnmowers...

But I do think it was DEFINITELY on the minds of consumers, but the government tried (successfully, I might add) to convince us that the economy was in NO DANGER....

Zoom:

Many predicted gas prices would be this high, if not higher. GM, as well as the other American car makers, along with the car buying public, put our collective head in the sand (pun intended) an wished it would all go away and gas would be $1.35 again. The oil co. new it was going up, government new it was going up, we knew it was going up, and yet many are shocked that no one is buying big vehicles they could barely afford in the first place. Which then leads us to the question, are we Americans, or are we Consumers.... As an American, I am more than my pocketbook or credit score, yet that is what gets hammered into us...buy, buy buy.

sbm,
Janesville is no longer dependant on GM, which at one time employed over 5000 people, not including suppliers. Except for the most recent housing debacle, Janesville has been steadily expanding for years, even as GM has been reducing their workforce here. Mercy health systems is now janesvilles largest employer.

I can't fault the city for investing in GM. If the city didn't build that road, you would be complaining that the city hasn't done enough to keep jobs here. The city is in a no win situation. This most current downturn has more to do with the type of vehicle GM makes in Janesville than anything else. Could anyone have predicted 5 years ago that we would be approaching $4 gas this summer?

Hey unknown you write what GM has brought here.

SSI was here for making balls for Parker Pen, the guy who started SSI worked for the Parkers.
Now I believe SSI make speed sensors for HD, and pressure switches for various apps.

Lear Seat only started because the Unoin allow them to farm out.

Janesville here are the choice?

1. Be like Flint MI.

2. Be like Madison.

It is a clear path. You only have weeks to decide.

I can't say I always agree with Jackson however on this point I do. The fact is we have tended to rely heavily on individual companies rather than making sure that this area has a strong economic foundation. Diversification of the job market is the only chance we have at surviving downturns like this. GM has steadily been reducing it's employee count over the years and yet rather than invest in attracting new businesses, a new road was built to ease access to GM! Well that seems to be paying off rather nicely doesn't it. The local news is filled with every move that GM is making and how bad it is for the local economy and residents, not everyone is tied to GM but there is a greater issue and that is ALL of the business that are closing their doors or cutting their shifts. With all the focus on GM there's nothing left to offer these other companies. There is talk about how well Beloit has done since Beloit Corp closed but making the old building look pretty and cleaning up the river area has not put all those people back to work in comparable positions. The average factory worker in this county not at GM is probably making half what the folks at GM are making - if they didn't see this coming over the years as GM has reduced their employees and prepare themselves for what was clearly coming that is their fault. They certainly had the financial resources to secure their future whether by cutting back, saving or getting an education that would give them options when the inevitable happened. For those making $10-15/hour and working multiple jobs to make ends meet, what are their options to do the same? Don't get me wrong, I feel for the GM employees about to be out of a job but it is time to look at the economic base as a whole and bring in companies that are diverse to make sure we don't end up here again. Even if GM turns around and brings back this latest round of lay offs, how long will it last and how many in the community will truly benefit from it? Can you name one company in Dane county that could cripple the economy by following in GM's path, I can't because it's a diverse market and they are not dependent on one company like we continue to be.

I don't say this very often, but Jackson, you're an idiot.

Your comments here just show ignorance and hatred of GM. That's ok, but please, for the sake of common sense...please stop...

I wish there was a way to place a question on the next election form for the area people which one
A. do you want area to invest 70% of tax comps to GM that only benefits a few, and leave a large carbon foot print, and dark image on Janeville.
or
B.do you want to invest in the future searching out green companies, bio tech, and high tech employer that will present a future for your children, and the area.

I would B for the future

wingnut,
Good points, but remember that GM employees at least can take a buyout. In most cases that buyout would either allow them to retire if they are old enough, or pay off their cars (or even a mortgage?) if they are not near retirement age and must look for another job.

The real tragedy will be the laid off suppliers, along with the other companies sbm_citizen mentioned. The best the suppliers will get is extended unemployment.

ok, now here comes a new angle to this discussion... what about the GM workers(or Lear, LSI, and the assorted subsidiaries affected by this news) who have no High School diploma? One cannot expect a man or woman to go from assembling vehicles or vehicle components for a pretty good wage to(and this is no slight against those that work there) flipping burgers at McDonalds? especially when one has a house and car payment to worry about. Not to mention gas and groceries which also are well above the level they were this time last year. Does GM or the other companies affected by this have anything in place to help out the workers that do not have a H.S. diploma? I am just curious to know if they are going to leave them twisting in the wind, or give them a helping hand to continue education in the goal of getting a decent paying job.
and on a side note, i just read that Ogden in Albany is closing so they can send the jobs in a reorganizing effort to Tennessee. wonder how long the new Ethanol plant in Evansville will last, with the way things are going.
And as far as the post by whocares, which included this little tidbit-There is press lately that GM is eager to get the Chevy Volt into production as quickly as possible in China where a fuel efficient car is the only thing that can compete in China. But when it's ready for production in China, it's also ready for production in the US. And what better place to build it than Janesville, where good workers are otherwise going to waste.- I hope to god you are right! gotta do what we can to try and compete with the Japanese nameplates, namely putting out more of these types of vehicles instead of more V8's!

I feel horrible for those employeed by GM and going through this tough time, And wish you the best of luck. And it sad that its having such a rippling effect on its distributing companies. But I honestly have to say if the plant it self has to leave then good.
When times weren't so hard GM has always looked out for it self. They have done a few things here and there for the community. But what about those in need of a job? Its my understanding the only way for opportunity is if you yourself is close to someone in the plant, just to get the application, and then you might be hired as summer help ,and then maybe 5 years down the raod be employeed fulltime.
This is the kind of action that got GM where it is today.
Those of you leaving GM will understand that when you take the buyout. And have to cut your wages in half pushing the dirty work just to make ends meet. It sucks. It would stink even more if you applied at mcdonalds at a time like this and they turned you away because you need to get app through your stepbrother who got it through his aunt who got it from her dad.
I pray more equal opportunity employers seek Janesville out.. in place of General Motors so those of you, who felt the effects of GM's loss will have a job else where paying but not limited to $6.15 an hour.
AMEN

dirksteel - efficiency is likely not tied to attendance as this would be hard to correlate. Attendence is also influenced by seniority. Janesville has a higher seniority than Arlington due to the age of the facility. With higher seniority, comes more time off due to accrual. This would require more coverage because of that. That would not be fair to compare the two facilities because of that factor. The article states efficiency and quality which means just that. What factors they were able to judge based on model mix and content is beyond me, so I think it is hard to compare the two. I believe it is because of the competition of having a Toyota Truck factory also in Texas. It would be a moral victory for Toyota in that region if GM had to give in by cutting a shift due to sales. Not fair to Janesville folks, but reality at most.

as I stated previously, anyone who lives in/around Janesville and thinks they are not impacted (either benefiting from good years or negative effects in bad years)is sadly mistaken.

Housing markets, and virtually every single purchase and living expense comes from the median income of the locality.

It is in everyone's best interests to try to assist and make an attempt to bear one another's burdens to the best of our ability.

I think it is very sad when I hear people celebrating in their neighbor's loss.

“Jackson” has been spewing this made up nonsense all over several of those blog and story comment areas-about the “dark” reputation GM Janesville and its workers have given the area. But what he doesn’t say is that he was summer help that could not get through one night at the plant. Come clean, Jackson. Do something to be proud of.

momof5 - I think diamond was referring to an obituary that was in Wednesday's paper for "Popcorn Joe" (http://www.gazettextra.com/obits/2008/ap......). Everyone at GM knew Popcorn Joe, and he will be sorely missed.

I'm guessing that this is what she was referring to.....

I used to get popcorn from him... :(

Who wouldn't like to be making the money GM workers make? There is nothing wrong with making more money, IF you earn it. The problem is that everything keeps going up in price, but not the wages. We should not fault GM workers for making a decent wage IF they deserve it. If I was able to make that kind of money, then maybe I could keep up with my bills, gasoline, food, healthcare, etc.

To Jackson:
I hope you are not referring that all people who work at GM are lazy. There are some that work really hard for the money they earn. But, if you are reffering to the ones that are always on comp so they can get paid to do nothing, then I agree. GM should be able to cut out the lazy workers and keep the good ones.

It's really great to see that GM is the ONLY business in Rock County! With all the debate about people at GM getting laid off and continuing to bring home most of their pay, with the state stepping in with all this "extra" for them - training, extended unemployment and yet the focus is on how poorly these people are being treated. Yes it's going to be a harsh reality check to see that the rest of this area doesn't make nearly what they do...NEWSFLASH! But where is the concern for all of the employees at other local companies that are or are about to be out of work?? United Industries is moving and my stepdad who has been there for 20+ years can't even look for a new job because if he leaves before they close the doors he is SOL on everything he has worked for. How about Alcoa - also UAW, they laid off 1/2 their shop since last fall and haven't work a full week in months - how much help do you think all their $11/hour workers have been recieving? How about the "lucky" ones that are still there but regularly "getting" 4-day weeks, nicely arranged to avoid unemployment eligibility. Oh wait, the company is promising to "give" them a full week off in May so they can actually get unemployment and not have to use all their vacation for this - IF it works for their schedule!
This is a much larger problem than just GM and the reality is the GM employees are better off than the vast majority of the local workers who are losing their jobs. Personally I am working on my masters in hopes that I can find a job in Rock county - not for a big raise, no I would just like to not have to drive an hour to make a decent wage. It is ridiculous to me that the local world revolves around GM, stop giving this company the power to determine the ecomony in OUR area. How many top GM people do think live in Rock cty? They don't care what they are doing to the community so rather than whine at their feet, stand together as a community and make sure that in the future the local economy cannot not be ruined by a Beloit Corp, Parker Pen or GM.

Jackson, do you have any idea how much GM has improved on their "carbon footprint" in the last 10 years? I'm sure not. There is a standard out there called ISO-14001 that they adhere very strictly to. They may actually be the greenest company in Rock County. Thanks for coming to this forum and spewing a lot of hate, (read other posts from other articles.) You can keep your liberal rants in Madison.

My apologies to diamondback if I referred to you in the incorrect gender -- I meant to put he/she in my previous post and missed that. Sorry!

momof5 - I think diamond was referring to an obituary that was in Wednesday's paper for "Popcorn Joe" (http://www.gazettextra.com/obits/2008/ap...). Everyone at GM knew Popcorn Joe, and he will be sorely missed.

I'm guessing that this is what she was referring to.....

Hey Jackson--do you live in Madison?

I can not wait for the rummage sales, and I bet the Janesville Gazette can not either! It will be called the GM workers White Elephant Sale. It will start in two years when the money dries up, and I am still working in Madison for $24 + for a green company.

I believe the best thing for the area is to let GM pass by the side. Janesville needs to invest in new employers, and get away from the carbon foot print GM makes on our towns. Janesville should look to invest in bring green companies to Janesville. GM, and there works leave a bad image on Janesville as lazy.

whocares: good point.

There's entirely too much pessimism being posted. There's still plenty of room for some optimism. 1) It's only a layoff of one shift - it's not a permanent elimination of one or both shifts. 2) If you're GM and you have to shut down production of vehicles consumers aren't buying, what better place to build brand new, market pleasing models than the out-of-work plants. 3) There is press lately that GM is eager to get the Chevy Volt into production as quickly as possible in China where a fuel efficient car is the only thing that can compete in China. But when it's ready for production in China, it's also ready for production in the US. And what better place to build it than Janesville, where good workers are otherwise going to waste. (In this economy an expensive new plant is not a good idea.) But of course GM Janesville, both management and labor, are way ahead of me on this. And the gov is probably doing the best he can to move this forward.
...
With no second and third shifts working, there's plenty of opportunity to do some plant upgrades for a new model - at least any work that can be done along side the existing line.
...
Think up. Feel the electricity in the air!

I am all for throwing TACT right out the window and REALLY debate the issues!!!!

OK

zoom--this thread here is pretty tactful...I posted that comment on 2 or 3 different threads re: GM's cuts.

diamond--I love popcorn (lol)! What news did you hear last night? GM related?

I can understand the emotions, but who is rejoicing? I read through all the posts again. Only two people said that there are cushy jobs at GM, or that they don't feel sorry for GM workers, or that Janesville will survive the loss of jobs. While they may not be your opinions, they are just that...opinions. The purpose of this blog is discussion. Asking people not to post is silly.

momof5-Well said !!! After hearing more SAD news last night...I will NEVER ! NEVER ! SMELL,TASTE OR SEE A BAG OF POPCORN AGAIN AND LOOK AT IT THE SAME !!!!!!!!!!!

dirksteel:

While I do agree that productivity and attendance go hand in hand and have been known to plague the Janesville plant, please read the link below. Oshawa's plant was one of, if not the most productive plants in GM's fleet of plants. Didn't save them, did it? I suspect there will be MORE of these types of announcements industry wide within the next year. http://www.thestar.com/News/GTA/article/...

Does it matter how much an employee gets paid? Seriously. If Burger King was announcing they were closing all of their Rock County locations, people would be on these threads berating them for not being smarter and going to school so they didn't have to "flip burgers" for a living. Bottom line is NO ONE should EVER be rejoicing when someone else has lost their job....regardless if they make $28/hour and pay minimal health insurance premiums or if they make $8/hour and have no health insurance. Lord help those out there who think they have job security and something like this could never happen to them.....unless you are a mortitian, there is no such thing as job security! And, to those who say GM will not make or break Janesville...tell that to Beloit and those who worked for Beloit Corp. GM may not matter to you, but it matters to the 1500+ UAW workers who will be without a job July 14th, if not sooner. Have some compassion and if you can't...then just zip it.

PLEASE STOP !!! NO MORE OF THIS GM ,THAT GM !!!DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS CHANGING LIFES.THE ONLY ONES THAT WILL MAKE OUT ON THIS IS THE BARS(people will drink away their jobs,families,lives)THE POLICE(ALL THE CALLS ON FAMILY ISSUSE)THE LAWYERS(DIVORCES,FORECLOSURES,BANK REPOSSESS ).AND PLEASE LETS NOT FORGET THE UNDERTAKERS.SOME HAVE ALREADY STARTED FOR FAMILIES... PLEASE JUST SHOW SOME UNDERSTANDING !!!THESE ARE HUMANS YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT !!!!

seabee: i think u should stop critisizing everyone and do something productive with urself. If u cant or dont understand the posts with the spelling, abreviating,shorthand or whatever then simply dont read them or comment on them either.

Here is my source for the previous comment I made...Complete with author and source...Note paragraph 6...Efficiency would include productivity and attendance.

................................................

General Motors plant in Arlington to lay off second shift next week

11:42 PM CDT on Tuesday, April 29, 2008

By TERRY BOX / The Dallas Morning News
tbox@dallasnews.com

The second shift of workers at the General Motors Assembly Plant in Arlington will be laid off next week as demand for full-size SUVs remains weak.

Wendi Sabo, plant spokeswoman, said the layoff is also related to a two-month strike by American Axle, a GM supplier. The Arlington plant is coming off a three-week shutdown and consequently has a small supply of axles on hand.

On Monday, the plant's first shift will report to work at 6 a.m. as usual.

The second shift will be laid off the entire week, affecting about half of the plant's 2,400 hourly workers. Second-shift workers will receive 95 percent of their base pay during the layoff.

GM also announced Monday that it is indefinitely suspending the second shift at its full-size SUV plant Janesville, Wis., which will affect up to 1,000 workers.

The plant builds the same general mix of full-size SUVs that Arlington does, but the Arlington plant is ranked higher in efficiency and quality.

If demand for full-size SUVs continues to drop, workers at both plants expect GM to ultimately consolidate all SUV production at one plant – a possibility that officials have not commented on.

"We're happy we have what we've got," said Enrique "JR" Flores Jr., president of UAW Local 276, which represents hourly workers at the Arlington plant.

"We're also saddened about what happened at Janesville. But we understand what is happening out there."

There are stories in the Dallas/Fort Worth area that say the decision to shut down the second shift at Janesville came down to productivity, quality and attendance!

Arlington beat Janesville in all 3 areas...Thus, Janesville is shut down and Arlington's 2nd shift will only be laid off one week.

To quote that famous presidential candidacy killer, Jeremiah Wright, Janesville's "Chickens have come home to roost!"

Apparently you have nobody else to blame but yourselves.

Instead of President Bush trying to push for more refineries we should all look at the alternative of salt water fuel. Read the article at http://www.saltwaterburns.com/. very interesting!

Does anyone know if the Gazette offers an "ignore" option on its forums?

GM can't "fudge" their finacials. Not only would their accounting firm risk major felony charges, but all credibility on Wall Street would be lost in the company. All GM's financials are full disclosed, and viewable to the public; as are any publicly traded companies. The story that some may be referring to was GM's Q4 2007 report, when an accounting error was made, in they did not figure in the pension compensation numbers correctly. The error was corrected; and GM stock was consequently pummeled on Wall street.

Right now GM is heavily in the red, and operating at a loss. Hopefully things will turn around for them for the sake US auto workers, and the many people in this community who work for GM or companies affiliated with them.

Purr, I honestly try not to, but with people posting their uninformed and poorly thought out theories and the borderline near-illiteracy, I get steamed at thinking of all the resources our society has wasted in the education of these creatins, judging by the results.

I wish they had a quote feature on this board..

lol Seebee...Ol' Purr is limping with a kink in her tail. I thought my post yesterday was fairly tame then came back to find I'd been accused of disrecting my parents in the 1950s and not having sympathy for sick lil' nippers...

Not on the GM topic, but a question to the more seasoned posters. After you post, do you ignore the reply comments made by people lacking in reading comprehension skills and those who make ridiculous leaps in logic?

I will definitely wait a few days before stirring up another can of worms...maybe a comment on spelling and the correct usage of their/there/they're...to/too/two...(evil cackle) ;p

Great post purrmaid....

Wow purrmaid, when you throw the gauntlet down, you REALLY throw it down. I commend you.

Ms_Sassy_Wi - LOL...I cast my vote for your mom. : )

Cocktail828 - '..teacher with a master's degree does make more if they maximize their degree and become a full time professor.'
Thank you for emphasizing my point. It shouldn't take "maximizing a Masters Degree and becoming a full professor" to earn more than a line worker when you've already got a Masters Degree.

Mr.Stacey T - '...let me guess your dad who worked there had a cushy job in the office'
Your "guess" is incorrect. He worked the line until he retired.

Wingnut721 - 'people like Purrmaid obviously have never worked in a factory type setting'
Worked at GM? No, just dad and my brother (who's taking the package..last day is in June). I have worked an assembly line elsewhere though. Definitely hit home that obtaining some marketable skills would be a bright thing to do!

Diamondback - 'not sure that her mother had to have a masters degree to teach in the 50's
Nothing in my post suggests a Masters degree was needed in the '50s. It was something you obtained through the years at your own considerable expense if you wanted to move up the pay scale.
- 'It's to bad she doesn't respect the job/work her father did in the 50's'
Both parents were respected, particularly my mother who went back to work six days after giving birth to my brother because GM was on strike and no money was coming in. I commend them for their tenacity.

Jennifer096 - 'IF I should lose my job @ GM, will you tell my children when they get sick and can't go to the doctor, why you don't have any sympathy?'
Sympathy for the kids? Yes, and not just because they are sick. However, I have no sympathy for dellusional parents thinking they are OWED a life-long job with premium health care benefits, mandatory mental health days, vacation time, numerous sick days, major dental and vision care, a labor union that will help them keep their job despite known drug use, fighting, employee theft, etc., not to mention some mighty fine discounts on vehicles. Sympathy?

Barrack Obama, where are you now?

For the record GM is not the only Company to go to such extremes to try and save their company. With times being what they are and have been for the past few years the Janesville GM plant is lucky that it has not been shut down/doors closed like a few other GM plants that were not quite so lucky.
I worked for another local company for 21 years when they closed our doors but because we were not a large company like GM the State did not jump in and offer us extended unemployment benefits or anything else for that matter. Also, I was making $32. per when we closed but I can tell you at the age of 53 I would jump at a chance to start a job at $14. per hour. But more and more jobs are being lost due to the economy.

You do not have to be an accountant to know the basics of a business. MORE MONEY MUST GO IN THAN WHAT IS PAID OUT. BE THAT WAGES,BENEFITS OR ANY OTHER EXPENIENCES.

ms_sassy_wi: amen sister!

btw: anyone who lives in/around Janesville and thinks they are not impacted (either benefiting from good years or negative effects in bad years)is sadly mistaken.

Housing markets, and virtually every single purchase and living expense comes from the median income of the locality.

It is in everyone's best interests to try to assist and make an attempt to bear one another's burdens to the best of our ability.

I think it is very sad when I hear people celebrating in their neighbor's loss.

cocktail848,

I'm not talking about tech schools cocktail.. I'm talking 4 year schools like UW Madison and the like... Sure, you can teach at a D3 school like UW-W and have a masters but try getting tenure.. I didn't say all 4 year schools want you to have a PH.D i said about 90 per cent.

Long_time_gone wrote: "Perhaps we keep the plant, and both shifts, working by slapping camo/sand paint on those SUVs and shipping them to Iraq."
.
My mother suggests we slap lead paint on them and send them to China.

Both very interesting alternatives...

lol

sure seems to be people on here again that have all the answers and aren't applying them to their own everyday lives. Anyone know what the topic is again? Rice? Spelling? Oh, yeah, that's right....it's about GM!

Zoom-THINK....OUTSIDE......THE .....BOX.... I'm sure the gov. just hasn't released the information yet.U.S Department of Labor I'm sure will give WI. a grant to help the workers.And by the way the rice issuse goes "OUTSIDE of JANESVILLES CITY LIMITS" Think outside the box :)I sure can make myself laugh !

dt32855, I cant say how much the union costs G.M. per year, but I can tell You that union dues are equal to two hours pay per month, quite costly, and its seems lately money not well spent.

Seabee- Yes I do get what you are saying.... I'm 59 years old and at times I don't get some of the new language and all the letters that are used in texting(LOL)I have A son that has problems with spelling etc...It's not because he hasn't/doesn't try !! Have a little more tolerance and understanding it will take you a long way in the BIG PICTURE OF LIFE !!!

Lear may get the 2 years of schooling. However, my understanding is that will be state funded and not by the UAW/Lear. My understanding is also that this is under an "umbrella" because lost jobs at Lear were due to outsourcing either within the last year or 2 years, and the cut-off is January of 2009 to be "covered" under this umbrella.

I am pretty sure Lear (and many of the suppliers) will only get regular unemployment. This is not including any severance package that may be offered. GM gets "subpay" in addition to their unemployment benefits during July shutdown or any other time they are "laid off." Lear never has....and from the sounds of it, never will.

RMaN4,

Where are you getting your stats that 90% of colleges make you have a PHD to become a full time prof? There are a lot of technical schools and D3 colleges that let individuals with Master's degrees be full time profs.

Diamond, only the uneducated rubes feel that way, which is fine because their opinions of me carry no weight whatsoever. no wut i meen dewd?????

NOW what about the workers with 30 plus years get out and let some of the ones with dependents and with the need for a job keep it. But then again greed seems to out weigh the the right thing and Yes i understand they have bills and obligations but after 30 plus yaers they should have a nest egg to hold them over with the offers pending at the plant. Sometimes with that income level some tend to live above their means and build bills and well some have to have the income with the costs now days but we have all had the crunch hit us with the city of Janesville based on GM wage and now some of them will feel it Dont get me wrong they work hard for their money and the last few years have been hard work as to more work on each job station. But If you have your 30 plus years in do the right thing step out and open the door so the ones that need to get to 30 years can!!!!!!!!

diamond,
This article says Lear employees will only get normal unemployment. Where do you get your misinformation from?

http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2008/apr...

SUPER~
You are right about those people. The people who ignore the new rules of the info. age will be those people breaking their backs to try and make a living. This isn't a knock on anyone either. It's what people have learned to do their whole lives. The key word here is "CHANGE". There are those who will never humble themselves to learn new things and there are those who want more out of life and want to move into the future and will humble themselves to learn new info. It's as simple as that. In the info. age, there will be 3 kinds of people. Those who choose to do business through the info. age, those who choose to work for the manufacturers who supply the network based business systems, and those who will simply buy from those businesses. The wealth available in this world today isn't found where people have been able to create over the past 100 years. It's in another sector of business. Problem is, people don't know where to look for it. That's why our economy is taking such a massive dump. The greed in corporate America is catching up with this country and the world in full force these days. Because the individual has access to the world behind the keyboard of a computer, the wealth that these corps. once owned, is now being dispersed to the general communities all over the place! The person who takes advantage of the new rules will prosper. The people who ignore the new rules, success will ignore them. I'm living proof of that. I'm not coming in here claiming I have all the answers. I've very simply humbled myself to admit, "I don't know what I don't know" and seeked out the right info. to take advantage of the future. My goal is help people understand that this is reality and they can do the same thing. That's all. Hope this helps.

diamond,
I didn't comment about the rice because there isn't a shortage in Janesville. If the Cozy Inn isn't giving you your rice, they have other problems. I have no problem getting rice from the other Chinese restaurants in Janesville.

I live in a world outside of Janesville. I am talking about SALES, you are talking about PRODUCTION. They are two different things. Just because GM may be overproducing at the end of the quarter doesn't mean people are buying them, which they are not. You seem to have identified a problem! Inventories are now just over 90 days for the large SUV's, and climbing. That is horrible.

The auto industry is one of the most scrutinized sectors of our economy. Investors have billions of dollars invested. Your idea that GM can "fudge" sales numbers is laughable. Your inside production info is anecdotal and has nothing to do with SALES.

When did I ever say I wanted or didn't want a job at GM? I have a nice job, thank you. I am just trying to find out what impact the $14/hour jobs will really have at GM and Janesville.

I have a couple of question for the GM employee's.
How much does the employee pay for union dues?
How much does the union cost GM yearly?

Zoom -What world do you live in ?? Come back down to the real world ! Have you NOT seen/heard that they have made mistakes!(lol)They have fudged #'s and I'm sure they will not stop anytime soon.Do you have any idea how many cars/trucks come off the lines at the end of quarters just so they can make they numbers ? They used to be a joke that you never wanted a car that was build on a monday,now you don't want one that was build at the end of the quarter, It's now called "SHIP IT". On your question on suppliers getting a package.. Lear should/will get $ and 2 years of schooling/training.By the way no comment on the rice? With all your questions it sounds like you may be changing your mind on getting a job at GM ???

diamond,
Sales numbers do not get "fudged". This is a publicly traded company. There are far more people (shareholders) watching GM than just us folks in Janesville.

I would agree that their is incentive for GM to lay off at Janesville and not the other two plants. And I would agree that there is far too little reporting on how this effects the supplier workers, who won't get 85% of their pay or a buyout offer.

cocktail848,

In 90 % of the cases, you need to have a Ph.D to be a full fledged professor...

Seabee,

Don't know if you are man or women, but with all the time you spend complaining about spelling and grammar, I will make an educated guess and say you are NOT a big hit with the opposite sex. Probably not your own sex either. Go play some online games and leave the normal people alone.

A teacher with a master's degree does make more if they maximize their degree and become a full time professor. Sorry, but if you have a master's degree and are still teaching K-12, it is your own fault you are making less than a person on an assembly line. In fact, I would almost go as far as saying you wasted money on a master's degree.

sassyone~
I agree!

People can point fingers all they want, and some of the pointing is jest, but I think what needs to be thouroughly thought threw here is, our country is truely in a dire straights. GM haters, instead of saying "ha ha", GM employees instead of saying "Good Ole Bush did it now", why don't we all unite and truely see how desparate our country is for unity. When a huge company such as General Motors is in such danger of becoming extinct, you know that there are bigger problems to come for our economy. The question is....what can we do? I am open for any and all suggestions, one thing though, I am thankful it is an election year, although it is becoming increasingly harder and harder to see who the best canidate will be. It seems that all people want to focus on is AGE, SEX and RACE this time around. That is hindering the true messages these canidates are trying to reveal. My plea to all is, let's be positive and have sympathy for our neighbors, after all we are all part of the same nation. I am so sad for the individuals that are directly being hit by this, and scared for the ones who are in danger of being hit in the future.

Seabee-Have you EVER thought just maybe some people have learning disabilities ??? If it upsets you so much to read some posts MAYBE it's you that shouldn"t be on here !Zoom..... As far as my thoughts on this being a trick.... Let me use a word that that you can understand... "UNDERHANDED" I have also seen the headlines,sales MAY be down a bit but have you ever thought that just maybe that they are fudging the numbers.It's hard too beleive but it can/does happen !! A high % of trucks that have been coming off the line here has been for the over seas market !!The second-tier jobs ...It's my thoughts that new hires will be in the plant July 14.You say how can that be !! "UNDERHANDED" I hope I'm wrong ..but nothing will/does surprises me.

Diamondback-GM will have millions of dollars of loss associated with the strike that have nothing to do with "vehicles sitting on the lot"

Please read my posting below and note that it says nothing about the vehicles on the lot with regard to tax loss/write off...It says that GM gets to draw down the massive amount of inventory on it's lots while writing off any losses on it's taxes.

It's the perfect storm in GM's favor...Understand they would have had to have even greater, more wide spread layoffs than we are seeing today if not for the strike...Then GM writes off any loss that they can document...They draw down inventory and the U.S. tax payer pays for it at the end of the year.

If I gave the impression that vehicles sitting on dealer lots were part of that loss, it was not what I meant to say.

Dirk

Perhaps GM/AAM/UAW are in cohoots in all this.

AAM workers stay out until they are bled financially dry and have to take any offer.

GM gets to draw down the excess trucks/suv/vans that are just sitting on the lot AND THEN WRITE IT OFF THEIR TAXES AT THE END OF THE YEAR!!!

If GM simply laid people off to reduce inventory they couldn't write it off the tax bill due...The strike allows that to happen.

The UAW bosses?...Who knows what "benefit" is being given to them to take the AAM people out.

The UAW has sold us all out in the national contract and now seeks to ruin long time workers to get them to buy out!

What would be their motive?...At Delphi, we couldn't figure out why the UAW wanted me to buyout or retire, then replace me with a worker making half the money and paying half the union dues.

TURNS OUT THAT THE DELPHI CONTRACT CONTAINS A CLAUSE THAT ANY BUSINESS SELLING TO DELPHI MUST ORGANIZE UNDER THE UAW AND PAY UNION DUES...THIS MORE THAN DOUBLES UAW MEMBERSHIP AND INCREASES DUES COMING IN, EVEN THOUGH AUTO WORKERS ARE BEING HIRED IN AT HALF THE WAGE!

NO DOUBT THE UAW/GM/FORD/CHRYSLER AGREEMENTS CONTAIN THE SAME VERBAGE!!!

I have asked several GM workers to ask their union reps if this is true...The UAW REFUSES to answer the question regarding whether or not non union parts/material plants must organize under the UAW whether their workers want it or not.

The bottom line is that GM workers were sold out by the UAW and now it's happening again...All so that the UAW would have more clout in the Democratic Party.

I hope all of you Union Brothers and Sisters who have always blindly voted Democrat because the Union told you "Democrats are for the workin man," are happy about being sold out by the UAW to gain power in the Democratic Party.

ASK YOUR UNION IF THE NATIONAL AGREEMENT REQUIRES SUPPLIERS TO ORGANIZE UNDER THE UAW OR LOSE THEIR BUSINESS WITH GM!!!...I GUARANTEE YOU WON'T GET AN ANSWER!!!

ewe r write!

This is a bit off topic, but I must address the comment made about my being "rude". Here is the deal, the Gazzette has provided people an opportunity to contribute their thoughts/ideas/beliefs/criticisms and funny anecdotes about the stories they put on this site. If a person wants to be taken seriously, if they care enough about a topic to submit their view on this blog/forum or whatever you want to call it, they should at least take the time to spell and punctuate at a fifth grade reading level. I understand that people make "typo" mistakes, I am guilty of this myself. But the blatant disregard of the conventional use of the english language exhibited by a number of the posters here does nothing but add to the belief that people around here are a bunch of uneducated rubes who have no business offering up opinions that they can't even articulate as well as a fifth grader. As far as my comment on unknown's post, I really do believe his/her life will improve if he/she does learn how to use the language more effectively.

And about the core/non-core issue - that's been already changed. The new non-core group was to take what have been considered the 'good' jobs. Those are the jobs that people with seniority have or get. Job's that the lower guys looked forward to getting when they had enough time. Well the problem there lies with seniority, it made it basically meaningless. You would never get off the line or get a better job with those guys taking those job. So that said, supposedly now that has changed. We were told that they would not get those jobs. They would come in and work on the line like the rest of us except they'll be making $14. As they acrue seniority they'll get to sign for jobs just like everyone else. Job placement still gets determined by a) if you signed up for the job and b) if your seniority is enough to secure that job. Supposedly as people retire, leave, die, etc.. the non-core folks would 'move-up' to our rate of pay. I find this hard to believe. I think GM wants a cheap disposable workforce. I also think Lear and other suppliers are really going to take a hit. At the new $14 per hour rate GM can build seats in plant cheaper and have faster quality control. Lear folks make what..$18 to $20something an hour? GM comes in and says to Lear...can you do the work for $14 per hour or less....we can. So unless they take a big paycut their done too. Like I said before this is not good any way you look at it and it'll just be getting worse.

Another thing about the information age/internet/computers is that it can all come crashing down with the flick of a switch or simply by pulling the plug.

Zoom, our plant was told we have 486 non-core jobs. Now with the recent re-rate and the upcoming layoff re-acceleration those numbers will have to be gone over again. So maybe that's why they are a bit ambiguous about the actual numbers, they don't really know. What we'll end up with is anybody's guess. We still have no local agreement, why is unknown. They (UAW) don't tell us anything other than "we're still talking". What I have learned today is that 4-17-95 will hold the plant (purely a thrown-up quick guess number by the rep that told me, he shall remain nameless). These numbers are before the buyout numbers which would make it later than that. Anyway you look at it, it's not good. That's pretty much everyone hired after the big 86' group. The 95' group was the last big group to be hired and the majority of them could be finished. Imagine working somewhere for 13 years and being told that your time put in there is pretty much meaningless.

The Problem with being in the information age is that information doesn't put food on the the table or shelter over your head. It can help make doing those things easier but someone has to grow that food, someone has to build that house, harvest those trees and transport things from one place to another. When economies fail, goods and services will hold value while information, however interesting, will do little to provide for human need. The internet has become primarily an entertainment medium. Without discersionary income in our pockets much of the businsess done on the internet will cease. The loss of industrial jobs throughout this country will have grave impact on its economy for years to come. For economic growth to happen we need to create tangible products that others demand. Information and its application are only usefull to the extent that they helps use produce and distribute tangibles more efficiently. Their is no ebay without a property to sell, their is no online grocer without groceries, no autotrader without autos.

GM obviously had to do something, and cutting jobs would seem to be the only real option at this point. Has anyone looked at the financials of GM? Christ, the entire balance sheet is HEAVILY in the RED. The stock is down over 40% in just the last 6 months. Really a gloomy day for the US auto makers. The possible hope on the horizon would seem to be getting a stake in the Chinese market. With a weak US dollar, and a booming auto economy in China, GM may very well benefit from this.

To all the "HATERS" on here of GM employees: Its sad that u all have nothing better to do with yourselves then bash everyone else, jealousy gets u nowhere in life. If you all think its so wonderful there then y dont u work there? I can explain Y its because 99% of u couldnt do the jobs, yes they make good wages heck I would LOVE their benifits BUT Ive also seen what the place does to people its not fun n games at all. The sad part is GM literally affects EVERYONE in 1 way or another in Janesville. so keep putting them down but dont cry when it then affects u.. If people would put all these hating/critisizing efforts into positive efforts maybe things would change! and we wonder why the kids today are the way they are?? gangs,violence,expultions and they just dont care..I think it all comes with todays society look at the adults shame shame!

We're in the information age. Colleges are still teaching people industrial aged education. Here's a newsflash for everyone....CNN and FOX aren't going to broadcast the fact that the industrial age is basically dead and the information age is upon us. You have to be ahead of the game with these trends that are happening. We're not dealing with info. moving as fast as the printed word anymore!! Information is now at the speed of thought. Problem is, what's the right info. and what's the wrong info.? The internet is an info. highway, however, there is alot of "whitesmoke" to sift through to get the right info. I would like to offer some friendly advice. I mean this whole heartedly too..... find someone involved in an "information based networking business" ...ask questions. If you want to move forward and get ahead, that's where it's at!! Hope this helps.

thanks for the support wingnut, and you are right, as long as detractors have never set foot in G.M. they will never understand. And no, there are no "cush" jobs in general assembly anymore, they used to be populated with higher seniority workers, older if you will, but the fact is they are gone. if you cant do a full days work at non stop speeds, your screwed, seniority means hardly anything anymore. the people with the real cush jobs are ones that have had good jobs since they had around 10 years in or so, sweepers, laborers ect. dont get me wrong, i dont disrespect them, but they are terribly out of touch, they can pass within feet of you doing your job, and not have a clue how you feel, as they take another 45 minute break, even with upwards 40,000.00 incentives to retire if you have 30 years or more, some are still saying, i'm not going anywhere, and i kinda understand...if i had a job like theirs, i'd stick around 10 to 20 more years to! As to CI and TC jobs, they are not what people think anymore, I, with twenty two years would not touch a CI job, they have to learn many jobs, sometimes as many as 25 or so, and never know where they are going to be put on the line, i'd rather know which "cell" i'm headed for everyday. As for TC's I was one, for a few months, it wasnt to bad, but that was two job cuts ago, so i've been back to the line again, for over a year ago, but you know what, i have a job, thats what counts, i dont have a problem earning my pay, i just sincerely wish people could try the place out, and try to understand, but the fact is most never will, and will continue bashing us. oh well, its a free country. And unlike some oldtimers that have never worked anywhere else in their adult lives, i have worked many other jobs, most in factory settings, and i guarantee that i had never worked this hard at any of them. i could go to the bathroom when i wanted, stop to take a drink, say hello to a co-worker, you know, just unimportant human things.

RMan, im thinking that is what my dad is going to do, go back to school and maybe learn a trade, get out of the factory sector.... depends on if he is one of the ones getting cut... apparently its too early to tell yet....

zoom,

Not sure, but I thought about 440 would be non core..

So non-core is what they are calling "second-tier"? Assuming that is correct, what percentage of GM workers do you think will be considered non-core? I assume GM will want to designate as many as they can, but I am just looking for a ballpark idea. Is there any silver lining here, or will the vast majority of the plant be considered second-tier?

It's time to put that economic stimulus package to work. Go back to school and learn something new. My company is downsizing a bit and my job has been directly affected. I saw it coming and was proactive in starting school a year ago. I'm not upset, no griping from me. I see it as making myself a better, smarter person and more marketable.

Thats turning a negative into a positive :)

what about all the people that work at factories this is going to effect? as i watched the news tonite i was very upset what was said, a rapid response team was being sent to assist the diplaced workers at gm, nothing about other employees, that would get assistance, gm workers are not the only ones that are going to be affected by this, but once again their the emplyees that are thought of. once again to hell with everyone else, the only people that matter is gm. and i by far am not bashing gm or its employees at all. and for those of you who once said, let them pack up the plant and move , who cares, well i do, my husband is probably going to lose his job after shut down. good luck to all of you.

It's time to put that economic stimulus package to work. Go back to school and learn something new. My company is downsizing a bit and my job has been directly affected. I saw it coming and was proactive in starting school a year ago. I'm not upset, no griping from me. I see it as making myself a better, smarter person and more marketable.

ZOOM,

Core jobs would be at full wages and thiose would be assembly line jobs.. Non core would be non assembly and therefore subject to the lower wage... I was under the assumption that GM corporate were going to go to each plant to designate core and non core..... I think the reason why it hasn't happened in Janeville yet is that they have laid off workers and the local agreement has not been ratified... I hope I'm right with my answer.

I dont know if this is a GM trick to get the numbers ( workforce ) down like they did with the fort wayne issue in 86 or if there trully hurting Gm has known for years they needed to get better gas miliage for the truck and SUV but the government hasnt forced them to do so. I hired in in 95 and have done many jobs down there including CI. I took the last round of buy outs after taxes you get 88k which isnt that much people thought i was crazy for getting out when i did ive been much happier and for the most part stress and pain free for 2 years now i do miss the money and i do miss the people they were more then co-workers they were part of your family but i surely dont miss the all the crap that come with it. To all the ones thinking of the buy out good luck in your desision it is a life choice and to the ones that stay in GM hell good luck to you as well wish i could say it will get easier but you and i both know working there it wont Good Luck GM'ers

RM,
I don't know what you mean. I was just curious about what percentage of jobs can be replaced with lower paid workers.

wingnut_721,

I hope like HE** that GM Janesville rebounds and goes back to full production..... And I hope they hire in as well.

ZOOM:

Are you talking core and non care?

Tater:

I was talking to a friend about that technology you mentioned... Seems really exciting.

Jennifer, I agree with you wholeheartedly, people like Purrmaid obviously have never worked in a factory type setting. My guess is they have the "REAL" cushy jobs, you know, ones where they sit on their tookus all day staring blankly at a computer screen and working in A/C., where the worst possible injuries are eyestrain and a possible paper cut. I have worked in a factory setting for the past 8 years, and i believe it is one of the toughest things one can do, you are always putting severe stress on every part of your body and for what one is paid, the toll your body takes sometimes seems a little unbalanced. Call the GM workers crybabies, whiners, lazy, you pick the adjective, but dont come in here and say they have easy cushy jobs unless you have tried factory work before. My father has worked for both Beloit Corp(15 years until they got bought out..)and GM for 10, he is a CI in Brake Deck and I was talking to him this past weekend and I asked him to describe what his job entails, and he laid it all out for me, and said he has a set amount of seconds to complete his task. He has had his share of jobs down there that the normal everyday citizen off the street would not be able to do. I have seen the toll that Beloit Corp and GM has taken on his body and it highly angers me to see people run the GM employees down through the press, calling them whiners, babies and lazy. Unfortunately, the anti-GM contingent in Janesville may get their wish after all...GM pulling a Parker Pen and closing their doors. Who knows, maybe in 2 years or so, Janesville as a city may be only a distant memory...a ghost town if you will. With all the new subdivisions popping up around the Janesville area, one has to wonder, who is gonna fill those empty houses? I would like to ask each of you out there to look at this issue through the eyes of those that are affected by this news, the GM workers, employees at Lear, LSI(good old trickle-down effect) and their families, and to show at least a sliver of humanity. Who knows, the tailspin that this country is in, YOUR job may be the next one on the chopping block....
Proud son of a GM worker,
Loren Tearman Jr.

Since experts have come to the conclusion that there is no way that US agriculture could provide this country's energy needs using corn ethanol, there has been much research to use more viable options. One of those is "dubbed 'cellulosic ethanol production.' It was developed by Coskata Inc. located in Warrenville, Illinois amd promises to make ethanol cheaply and efficiently from virtually anything organic-based. The long list of possible sources include used tires, crop waste, sewage, household kitchen waste, yard waste etc.' {http://www.dailytech.com/Cellulosic+Ethanol+Promises+1+per+Gallon+Fuel+From+Waste/article10320.htm}
This technology sounds exciting and is just one more way that hopefully will allow America to become less dependant of foreign oil.

Question: What percentage of GM workers are considered "second-tier"?

It's a trick I tell ya!

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080428/gm_cuts.h...

Thanks Rayzor, forgot about that.

diamondback,

I'm not claiming I have all the answers diamondback, your the one that is claiming it... A poster mentioned cushy jobs in the front office and there are cushy jobs in general assembly...

RMaN4(:ann:) You really are funny ! TC's aren't the only ones that work overtime that get paid! I'm sure most TC's would like to go home after working 10/hrs ??? I wouldn't say 50 cents extra an hour the CI's are getting rich or any extra thanks from you! IT's people like you that have worked what 5 months at GM that have all the answers !! NICE! REAL NICE!

What happened to the GM, UAW job security agreement? The Union made a big deal about it, but it does not seem to working out all that well. I was wondering if I could get a refund of my Union dues?
And Gary, nothing is coming to Janesville.

Bring back the S-10 and make it in Janesville. The last model line was the best and then they quit making them.

After 2006, GM Janesville cut jobs and added those cut jobs onto other employees (loading up jobs) So comparing 2006, or the work load of years ago to the new standards isn't fair... Lower wages and more work is the new standard.

zoom wrote:RMaN4,
Ethenol must still be mixed with regular fuel to get E85 (85% ethenol, 15% gasoline). Vehicles are not designed to run on 100% Ethenol, due to it's corrosive nature. I'm gussing that the Milton plant isn't set up to mix in regular fuel and sell it.

Actually, a car COULD run on 100% Ethanol. The Feds mandate to put the gasoline in it to poison it so that people dont use it as a beverage.

purrmaid, If GM hires workers @ a lower wage, fill out an application and come see just how "cushy" our jobs really are. I promise, you will have sympathy!!

Purrmaid made a valid argument on why should unskilled laborers at the plant make more than highly educated teachers? I know several educators that have masters degrees and they don't come close in annual income as a unskilled assembly line worker at the plant.

sorry i my last entry it was suppose to be NOT instead of NOY it has been a long and VERY stressfull day

seems to me that purrmaid is just a VERY jealous person and does not have a caring bone in her body. janesville will suffer and so will other business in the area if this whole lay off is longterm!!! i hope purrmaid does noy ever lose her job and find people like her talking all this crap!!!!

purrmaid, IF I should lose my job @ GM, will you tell my children when they get sick and can't go to the doctor, why you don't have any sympathy?

Bottom line is the GM product is not something average consumers are buying. Tough times or not, companies that can find a way to get people to buy their products (even in times of a not so booming economy) will survive and those who don't will not. If GM could either build a product that more appealed to consumers (either through price or a better product) they would be o.k. But they don't. Their prices are higher on the luxury models than comparable vehicles made by other manufacturers and the quality is not there on the lower end vehicles. In a trying economy and with gas prices as high as they are, people are going to buy to save money. Either through sticker price or gas mileage. The Malibu and the Impala are great cars. They are even comparably priced to the Accord and the Camry. But they do not have the track record of the Accord and Camry. If GM would have been able to design and build a longer lasting, more dependable vehicle 10 years ago we would not be having this discussion. I bought 2 brand new 2008 Toyota vehicles this year. I traded in 2 GM vehicles. As a consumer, I made the choice that was best for me. GM just didn't have what I wanted and their prices were too high. I think that is what is happening all across the USA and not just in this little GM town. I for one hope GM can turn it around. It will be sad to see another Janesville Icon go down as Parker Pen did.
Bottom line is build a product that the average consumer wants and can afford and it will sell. Simple economics.

not ripping on g.m.,but just wondering.why do they stop making the cars & trucks that are doing well,and decide to go big,biGGER,BIGGEST. chevettes were doing well.s-10's(all them were a hot seller).now,i hear? no more trailblaiser.well gotta hop on my new scooter now,to go to the store.

diamondback:

I did have padded gloves when I did the door panels, still the reptitive motion after 10 hours 4 to 5 days a week can take its toll...

Your right, CI's had to know all of the jobs in their section and they are paid extra for it... The TC's would usually leave after the shift ended unless they had to go out back at which they collected OT...

I have alot of friends and family that work at the plant in Janesville. I realize that society feels that they are overpaid but with the economy the way it is today some of them are almost at poverty level, and buying a Toyota isn't helping their situation!!!!!!

Wisconsin is a TAX HELL for business.

As a life long Janesville resident, I have to say that in my opinion 14.00-15.00 an hour for non-skilled labor is a pretty good wage now-a-days. There are many of us, both single and married, who try to make a comfortable living for ourselves and our families on this amount. Sure, we may not have a brand new car every 1-3 years, and our annual vacations may consist of a long weekend up-north, but darn it we're happy. Our kids and our grandkids love us dearly and they don't care that we may not have the fancy "toys" or "gagets" that Johnny's parents do.

I grew up us a daughter of a GM employee, and the wage my father earned helped provide for all 7 of us kids. Still, there were no annual vacations, no new cars, and my siblings still remember the times we were all taken to the UAW hall for free meals.

The Janesville GM plant has helped raise many families in the past, but I don't believe that it was the good wages that contributed to any of our childhood memories, nope, I have to give credit to my parents for that.

So please, stop refering to the 14.00 an hour wage as degrading, I may only make 14.00 an hour, but I know that I am worth so much more, and that's what counts. We are all in this together!

SarahB- you go girl!!! seabee has always been rude and nasty,and I believe he has done that to unknown before. I kinda enjoy unknown and hannah :) they make me smile !! do you think they type faster than they think ?as i said they make me smile !

Seabee: I was going to compliment you on your first posting here, but then you pissed me off with your rudeness toward "unknown". Perhaps he has trouble typing alone and not with spelling and punctuation. Regardless, everyone has a right to comment here. So, I guess it is your right to be rude. It just isn't becoming of you however.

RNaN4-You are funny ! Typical TC-CI have the "cushy" jobs ?? TC's have MORE paperwork and training than the foremen... CI's have to know and do every job on the line.Some areas of paint can / do get too be 110 degrees,body shop is no better.On most days paint/body shop come in early and work thru lunch and breaks not to forget the coverups that they have to wear.If your hands hurt you could/should of used wraps.As far as "PURMAID" I'm not sure that her mother had to have a masters degree to teach in the 50's ?? It's to bad that she doesn't respect the job/work her father did in the 50's working at the plant.By the way did you get the letter from GM asking if you wanted to work there again ?? But I'm sure you wouldn't want to do the job for $14.00/hr.That's why it's called summer help.and I'm sure the regular workers were very nice to you !

mrbread-I don't remember writing anything regarding the economy, our country, or diplomacy. I spoke about the bash Bush rhetoric on the price of gas. He is trying to stimulate the economy. I would assume you are going to give your stimulus check to me since you are ungrateful? I bet it really is a bitter pill to swallow for you anti-Bush people to accept a economic stimulus check from him. You will have to educated me on what the Democratic controlled Senate has done for the same points you blame Bush for. As everybody knows, the president doesn't run this country by himself. That would be a dictatorship.

Your right "local boy", Bush has done a great job with the economy, our country, and diplomacy. It would be really difficult to pin anything on a president who has done so much good during his tenure.

You people out there with the "blame Bush" rhetoric have to get a reality check. The president has about as much control over the price of gas as he does the price of XBox 360. If you studied the industry, you would know that. But, it is to easy to read your Union shop committee report, and follow the uneducated liberal propraganda put forth by your shop chairman. GM continued to produce those SUV's because there was a market for them. Now that there isn't a large market for them, GM no longer needs 3 plants making them. Anybody and everybody at GM-Janesville knew the run would end eventually. What the UAW and GM in Janesville have been doing, is trying to position themselves with a effecient, economic, and hard working workforce. This I believe is not gone unrecognized within the corporation. I hope for the remaining employees left, that the SUV product gets replaced with a new high demand product. The local Management and UAW have managed to keep Janesville going much longer than any auto expert ever thought. Most had it condemened over 30 years ago. This is due to the 99% of the good employees, not the 1% deviants you hear about. Unfortunately, Janesville and the surrounding community are highly reliant on the GM business. Janesville is mostly handcuffed due to a economically flawed business growth policy currently ran by our state government. All you have to do is check out the State of Wisconsin's Workforce development website and compare it to Alabama's own same website. Wisconsin's is full of news about grants to help displaced workers due to closed industry. Alabama's is full of news of more companies opening or expanding there. Check it out. We must be doing something wrong. Wisconsin is slowly falling behind and soon will only be known for our DNR supported activities. Low paying "service" jobs. I don't how to fix it, but I want to help change it if I could. Any thoughts?

staceyt:

I worked at the plant as a temp employee in the summer of 2006. I agree with what your saying on what a lot of those jobs can do to your body overtime...I would come home after 10 hours and my wrists (door line) would just throb..

There are a lot cushy jobs in the general assembly too and not just the office.. Look at your typical TC or CI tell me they don't or didn't have cushy jobs... The body shop, paint department, maintenence had thier share as well..

Purmaid had a vaild point about a teacher with a masters degree being paid less than an unskilled assembly line worker.

crazyinjvl- You are right..Those stupid monstrosities GM builds and call "hybrids" are NOT.
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ONCE AGAIN, toyota has the very BEST vehicle for the times.
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Guess they didn't learn anything last time around.
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BAFFLING.

I was just watching the history channel today that was orginally aired in 2004 about global warming and using ocean water as fuel. Why haven't they done anything about using water for fuel yet?? They were talking about how gas prices were going to soar in price. And this was aired 4 years ago! Big oil and big money own this country.

Did I miss the part where Zoom was elected as the moderator for this discussion?

seabee....thanks for the post. it is a shame that the lefties still want to spew that vile rhetoric. in reality a president has not one say in the price of gas. the sheiks and the investers in the future markets set the price. if you believe different then you are in denial of reality of economics. i get it and i'm FAR from an expert. gm made a BIG mistake thinking the SUVs were here to stay. almost everyone in this town could have told you the big vehicles were future moongooses. a trick? man, you people are really paranoid. what did gm do? go out and make people STOP buying the big, can't see around, trucks? DUH!!!!!

hey purrmaid..... have you ever worked there ???probably NO you claim they are over paid you see the toll it takes on your body to do that every day for ten hours a day let me guess your dad who worked there ha d a cushy job in the office or something ....other wise i don't think you would say they are over paid for what they do.. second you tell my kids that they can not do anything that they are used to doing because of their father lost his job ! i have been talking care of my sick parents so i have not been able to work and do that and take care of my family so what do you think we should do NOW?? please don't comment on things you really have no idea about !!!

Sympathy? I have plenty. The company sure had a hand in making its workers feel insulated from the rest of the world (and its problems). I could drudge up even more sympathy, though, had auto workers everywhere abided by their own "Buy Union" ethic back when it could have meant something for workers in other sectors. Apparently it never applied to US-grown crops, US-made clothing, US-made appliances ... and once China started shipping cheap stuff, where's my Visa card?

Locals in other unions, if only they still existed, would have reached out.

My dad went to work at the Janesville GM plant after he was discharged from the Army after the Korean War. Every single year, he made more money than my mother, an elementary ed teacher who struggled through night school and summer school to obtain her Masters degree. I have no sympathy for any GM workers losing their job, they've been overpaid for decades and had cream of the crop job bennies that would choke a horse. Welcome to reality. Sprint's severance package was only two weeks pay for every year you'd been with the company, up to a year's pay and a $1,000 signing bonus. If I were a GM worker, I'd take the money....NOW!

Zoom-You won't think the rice shortage is funny when you go to the Cozy Inn and not get your rice.Try to think outside the box.Yes most families don't buy 20# bags but restaurants do.A lot of the smaller restaurants buy from the local stores.

dirksteel-Let me understand what you are saying??? Are you saying vehicles sitting on GM lots??(Plants)If that whats your saying you are wrong!! If GM has 2008's left and 2009's come out the dealership has to BUY x amount 2008's in order to get the new 2009's. What do you think GM does with last years model ?? I'm sure they don't send them to the junk yards !It's not a tax write-off.Some people just don't get it !!

zoom:

Thanks... Wouldn't you think when they built the ethanol plnat in Milton that they would have a similiar operation as Monroe's?

RMaN4,
Ethenol must still be mixed with regular fuel to get E85 (85% ethenol, 15% gasoline). Vehicles are not designed to run on 100% Ethenol, due to it's corrosive nature. I'm gussing that the Milton plant isn't set up to mix in regular fuel and sell it.

Some punctuation would also be in order.

Well unknown, I'll bet that if you learn how to spell, your prospects will improve.

I'm hoping that some one can help me as I've been reading the blogs about E25 and E85. I have no idea where to find E25 and E85 for under $3. It would be nice to have that information along with who has the lowest price on E10 without driving all around town it really ticks me when I pay 10-15 cents more a gallon for gas say in Janesville when I travel to Beloit and find it for less. On another note my Brother worked for GM for 35 years and he wasn't sad to go and as far as who to put the blame on...well there's plenty to go around and it's all our fault we as consumers have done little to demand change...from the vehicles we drive to the homes we live in...Everyone needs to be thinking about a better way. We have been spoiled too long. As far as GM and Ford build a better vehicle...the internal combustion fossil fuel burner is a thing of the past an until they realize that they are doomed like back in the late 70's-80's when the foreign automakers got a strong hold...don't let it happen again...Build it and I will buy it.

dini,
I was speaking about the RICE rationing in the U.S. that you brought up. Please don't exaggerate my words.

The rice rationing IN THE U.S. has created a false scare. People hear on the news about one store, and think they have to go buy rice before it's gone. In one case, the limit was five twenty pound bags per person! When was the last time the average American bought a twenty pound bag of rice? It has been overblown.

BTW, I do think corn based ethenol is a boondoggle that deserves to die.

I agree with ctr1. I worked down there during the summers while I did my undergrad work. It was an eye opening experience. It made me want to get my degree as fast as I could so I would never have to do that. It is not the GM of the 80's at all. And every summer I came back, more and more items were added to jobs. Of course, I also got to see how the union had too much power. Looking back, I can see why Toyota now has taken over as the world's largest automaker. This is not the majority by any means, but on a few occasions, employees would show up drunk at work in my area. One even ruined a half-built vehicle by driving a fork lift into the line, he/she should have been canned immediately, but because of the union, they were suspended without pay for 2 days. Again, that wasn’t the majority, just floored me that the company could not fire the individual.

I wonder why the Milton ethanol plant doesn't have a public fueling station... Any idea?

Of course E-85 isn't completely to blame and these food shortage problems didn't crop up overnight. Again,economists saw them coming years ago (but didn't predict the full impact of diverting food crops) -- which makes it all the more obscene that we are fueling our vehicles with what used to be food.

Or is that a good thing -- reducing the poor populace by attrition? Attrition's always a good policy, right, GM?

Zoom, what are you thinking? Are you unable to understand the crisis of major retailers RATIONING any food whatsoever? What the heck is funny about taking away the one and only food source that some entire populations consume -- so we can run our vehicles cheaper? Food crops should never, ever have been diverted into energy crops.

I don't think E85 is completely to blame. Most foreign makes can't even use E85. High oil prices have caused transportation prices to rise, which has a bigger impact than E85.

rice rationing is pretty funny, and rediculous at the same time....when is the last time you bought a 20 pound bag of rice?

E-85 = egg prices that have doubled in a year; rice now being rationed at major retailers, an outright "global food crisis" where grains formerly sent to impoverished nations are now fueling your flex vehicles, and there must be sand dunes in this city because I have never seen a group of people with their heads more buried. It seems the only people "shocked" by this latest GM move is the workers themselves. The rest of us have been whispering about the demise of this plant for years. We have to whisper because we get our tongues cut out if we say anything aloud.

It IS gut-wrenching. The turnaround that's about to take place in the lives of many of my friends will be disruptive beyond their wildest imaginings.

As A Janesville G.M. employee, I have to take all news and or comments with a grain of salt. As an "86'er" it puts Me at 22 years of seniority. That being said, G.M. does not really care about employees, but rather profit, but hey, isnt that the point? But wage scale has to be fair, the salary and bonuses enjoyed by CEO's in My opinion are not justified, what could they possibly do that is worth more money then they could ever use? When average families could use a few extra dollars just to keep up with rising fuel costs, food costs ect. But never fear, G.W Bush is here with His economic stimulus package, it'll be just enough to catch up on My power and light bill from last winter, maybe. I dont expect to sit on My duff all day and make a good wage, I work hard for My paycheck, for people that believe that its still the 1980's at G.M., wake up and smell the coffee, We bust butt these days, when I arrive home after work, My kids want to play, but I have to take a break. Its killing My body. To bad We wont be using summer help this year, its a good eye opener for many young, and all ages of people to see what really goes on in the Janesville plant. But alas, some people never want to see whats really there. Do I blame all of this (production loss) on G.M. absolutely not, purely economics, gas prices, ect. Fact is, I get out of bed everyday, go to work, do My job to the best of My ability, because quality ensures work, and still have to here managements continuous babbling, You have to do more, why is the line down, You should be running to Your next job ect. Call Me old fashioned, but shouldnt We be led by example? Grab a pair of gloves big boy, show us how its done, fact is paramedics wouldnt be able to keep up with the heart attacks that would be happening. So, i'll continue to go to work (hopefully) and do My best, and hope this country can upright itself, because it sure has capsized.

zoom some people don't care about being upside down. they care that they have want they want and able to afford the payment. plus this will hep gm move them and keep people in jobs

Diamondback-Any costs/losses associated with the strike can be written off taxes at the end of the year...Everything GM can justify will be listed as "Loss due to strike" when the tax man comes

vetman,
I hope you aren't saying a 7 year loan is a good thing! That is called being upside down if you ever get in an accident, and you owe more on your auto loan than the insurance will pay off.

The question should be, do most families NEED a ginormous SUV? Do they need seating for seven on a daily basis, or tow a boat all year long? Sheesh, how did we ever get along without them ;) ?

well except the girlfriend thing, that might have been Clinton's fault. Was she ever an intern?

one of the only other ways to move the vechiles is to extend the auto loan term. that way it will lower the montly cost of owning a new suv. monthly cost for a 40-$55,000 is way out of the ballpark for most families even now with the gas prices at 3.54 per gallon need to go to 7 and 8 year loan. or more

I've been running it in my Oldsmobile for well over a year now and no problems. A GM tech is who told me, thats as close to a manufacurer as you can get since E25 isn't sold in the majority of stations.

I would only trust the manufacturer to tell me if my car could use E25 without long term effects.

vetman......well said!

seabee--thanks for a good laugh and funny visuals. Alas, I cannot wait until January 2009 though.....

On the average E85 mpg loss, it takes E85 to be 65 cents a gallon less to break even, after that it's money in your pocket but to see that, you have to go to Monroe to the ethanol plant where they have pumps where the public can buy E85, E25, and regular E10. On Friday, E85 was $2.67, E25 was $3.35 and E10 was $3.50 over there. Everyone should call the plant in Milton and see if and why they're not doing that! Another tid bit of info passed along to me by a technician, E25 can be run in all vehicles without having any drivability issues except a 1-2MPG decrease.

what janseville gm needs to happen is that gm changes what is built in arlington . maybe bring something back from mexico. i hope that it is just a sacre.

dirksteel-The cars/trucks/vans etc.. sitting on car lots ARE NOT a tax write-off for GM!!! The car dealerships PAY for those vehicles.

I was late for work today. That never happened when Clinton was president. My cat got hit by a car last week. He was a happy kitty while Clinton was president. I bought a jet-ski in 2000. The motor blew in 2003. Ran fine while Clinton was president. I hurt my back from shoveling all the snow we got this winter. Never had this much snow while Clinton was president. My girlfriend dumped me because "I don't understand her needs". I understood them just fine when Clinton was president. My next door neighbor still has a shovel of mine he borrowed last summer. He always used to return things on time when Clinton was president.I've gained 35 lbs the last 7 years. I weighed much less when Clinton was president. The Packers haven't won a superbowl in a long time, but they did when Clinton was president. Janesville has a lot of thugs for a town this size. It wasn't that way when Clinton was president. I've accumulated 30 grand worth of debt the last 7 years. I didn't owe anybody anything when Clinton was president. I am no longer allowed to smoke in bars in Madison. Used to be able to do that when Clinton was president.
OBVIOUSLY all the things in my life that suck are the fault of George W. Bush!
(for those of you that are victims of the Janesville public school system, this post is 100% sarcasm.)

And biofuels are causing crop prices to rise so more can starve, and causing an even quicker deforestation of the rainforests. They need the land to grow even more crops. Yeah E-85 is not the answer.

Perhaps GM/AAM/UAW are in cohoots in all this.

AAM workers stay out until they are bled financially dry and have to take any offer.

GM gets to draw down the excess trucks/suv/vans that are just sitting on the lot AND THEN WRITE IT OFF THEIR TAXES AT THE END OF THE YEAR!!!

If GM simply laid people off to reduce inventory they couldn't write it off the tax bill due...The strike allows that to happen.

The UAW bosses?...Who knows what "benefit" is being given to them to take the AAM people out.

The UAW has sold us all out in the national contract and now seeks to ruin long time workers to get them to buy out!

What would be their motive?...At Delphi, we couldn't figure out why the UAW wanted me to buyout or retire, then replace me with a worker making half the money and paying half the union dues.

TURNS OUT THAT THE DELPHI CONTRACT CONTAINS A CLAUSE THAT ANY BUSINESS SELLING TO DELPHI MUST ORGANIZE UNDER THE UAW AND PAY UNION DUES...THIS MORE THAN DOUBLES UAW MEMBERSHIP AND INCREASES DUES COMING IN, EVEN THOUGH AUTO WORKERS ARE BEING HIRED IN AT HALF THE WAGE!

NO DOUBT THE UAW/GM/FORD/CHRYSLER AGREEMENTS CONTAIN THE SAME VERBAGE!!!

I have asked several GM workers to ask their union reps if this is true...The UAW REFUSES to answer the question regarding whether or not non union parts/material plants must organize under the UAW whether their workers want it or not.

The bottom line is that GM workers were sold out by the UAW and now it's happening again...All so that the UAW would have more clout in the Democratic Party.

I hope all of you Union Brothers and Sisters who have always blindly voted Democrat because the Union told you "Democrats are for the workin man," are happy about being sold out by the UAW to gain power in the Democratic Party.

ASK YOUR UNION IF THE NATIONAL AGREEMENT REQUIRES SUPPLIERS TO ORGANIZE UNDER THE UAW OR LOOSE THEIR BUSINESS WITH GM!!!...I GUARANTEE YOU WON'T GET AN ANSWER!!!

zoom. very true. e85 is cheaper per gallon, howerver you get less MPG with e-85 and in the long haul it actually costs more to use E-85 than regular unleaded.

yes he was not perfect but at least our country was not this screwed up. gm was working 50 hours a week and gas was not almost 4.00 a gallon!! thanks george

theres sheer brilliance. blame it all on bush. yeah pervert bill was so much better. he didnt have a clue what was going on in this country. to busy with his intern under his desk.

Before Bush cheated his way into office we at gm Janesville where working 50 hrs/week making Med. duty trucks and suv's. Now look at the mess he has us in. Good luck janesville been nice knowing you. Man I miss Bill

zoom: My husband has done the research on the Malibu. Thanks for the link, I will pass it along to him.
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And, for the record, I'm abut as apt to burn E85 as the tree-huggers are to allow drilling in Anwar.
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While car sales are down industry wide, I cannot help but feel GM caused this themselves. Look at their design and styling over the last 5-8 years. Straight across the board--Sturn, Buick, Pontiac and Chevrolet--they looked the same and were boring. The Malibu is a GREAT step in the right direction to recapturing the market. The G6 has doen well. I know it is localized, but I see A LOT more full-size GM SUVS than any other make (and I do not live in Janesville). Dodge went through this same funk and reinvented themselves.
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As a business owner myself, I can see the positives in what GM is doing to restrcutre their pay scales. Does that mean it doesn't hurt people themselves or local economies? Of course not. I will be affected as well.
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Janesville UAW workers have not worked a full 40 hour week consecutively in nearly 6 weeks due to the AMM strike. However, there is still a surplus of vehicles on the lots despit the lower output. This announcement could be a scare tactic but evidence points in a different direction, I guess. Desptie the conjecture, no one will know for sure until July.

Zoom
I'm not looking in buying a used suv. We usually lease a new veh because of the cost difference. 2nd I need a higher style vehicle to beable to get in and out easier due to my disability. We always bought gm vehicles, now own a trailblazer, lease is up this year, but with the cost of gas and the vehicles we have to reconsider buying an american suv...

shocky: I don't know what Tahoe you are driving that is only getting 10-12 mpg. I get atleast 17-20 in my Denali. What I do agree with is the cost of domestic made vehicles, in general. I don't know if halving the workforce and their pay is the answer or not, and while the trickle down effect will sting for the immediate furture, it may be a step in the right direction for the longevity of the company and industry. The economy won't always be this rocky. Like everything in life, this too shall pass.

momof5,
The Malibu has been getting good reviews.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/chevrol...

GM (and Ford) have actually been making flex-fuel vehicles for a long time, so I'm not worried about the technology. They were just never marketed much until the last few years.

If you do the math, you still come out worse using E85.

just so we are all clear that was my husband not me as staceyt i just know that my gut is in knots and i think it would be great for them to let the employees and their families know all this info before the general public i have had 3 generations of people working there and it has been nothing but rumors since they opened oh they are closing at the end of this year and the end of this year i for one am just sick of all the lies that are going back and forth it is hard to have a family and function eveyday when you keep hearing all of this ......it is really hard to plan for the future when you are not sure if there will be one!!!!

shocky52,
Used SUV's are getting cheaper. The people that don't really use them for what they were intended will dump them to buy something more fuel efficient. Even so, why would you buy a cheap SUV that gets 12mpg when gas is $4/gallon.

zoom--point well taken. I know e85 doesn't burn as well. But, when there is a 75 cent/gallon price difference, it does help and is ultimately in the best interest of the person paying at the pump. Too little is known about these flex fuel engines and how it will effect the longevity of the engines.
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What I really meant though, what that the Malibu, for a mid-sized sedan, gets pretty decent gas mileage (near 30 on the highway). I looked into buying a VW Beetle, and they get about that.

well i guess its time to ween myself off the bottle.baby bottle not the beer i dont drink, another stereo type about gmrs My 11yrs.have been nothing but rumors working there is been hell.shift changes,job cuts,bla,bla,bla.CAN you tell i've had enough of the crap.thank you for reading this its time to go to work yeah i work nights.blow me a kiss when i'm leaving smooch!!!!!!!

truth1,
GM has a hybrid, it just isn't made in Janesville. A 5000+ pound SUV that gets 20mpg and costs $53K isn't the answer.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008-gm...

"Janesville will get over the loss (of GM..."
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Yes, right, after Janesville looks like Beloit circa 1980-2000.
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Good luck to all those who are forced to relocate or decide to stay, and chose to downsize their lives.
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In either case, plan on losing at least 35% of your home value. How's that serve your retirement plans.
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Oh, and when you decide to splurge for a movie and Applebees, hope they have enough business from non-GM families to remain in Janesville.

If GM made the suv's less expensive maybe the people could afford them. By time you pay 40,000+ for a tahoe and then have to pay 4.00 per gallon and get about 10-12 mpg where is the money coming from to pay the rest of your bills...

Hey Diamond..This is not "84" and this is no trick, this is the new reality. Not only is Janesville competing against high gas prices, but against Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Kia and the rest. GM no longer has the cash to play tricks.
To those left at the plant, TAKE THE BUYOUT! Don't try to ride this out. It is not 84 again. Think about it, this product is not in deamand and there is nothing GM has to bring in to replace it. I am sure they don't need a second plant to build the Malibu.
GM doesn't need Janesville, and Janesville will get over the loss. Take the money and start of new life.

tgncj said - "Long time gone-How has this president screwed the American worker?"
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Let's start by taking $1 trillion dollars out of the American credit markets, handcuffing business, both small and large, from making capital investment in machinery, equipment, and personnel - not to mention R & D in green tech.
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American workers need business to grow, to create jobs, and without ready capital in the form of credit, business limits their production, or expansion, and subsequently, jobs are lost.
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If you are still on-line, what else ya got for me? How 'bout we talk about the value of the American dollar, or the Fed, or tax cuts during a war?

Funny how Toyota is the ONLY one with a TRUE hybrid.
Why can't they do a little "re-engineering" and make these Janesville-made things operate like a Prius?
THAT would be the answer, but I guess thats just TOO much effort for GM.
A prius is CAPABLE of nearly 70 mpg, but with NO competition, they are SO expensive you can't afford one.

You would think that the buyout would be more for people under 10 years since they aren't vested in the pension plan yet like the ones with 10+ years. Get the lower seniority out before it actually costs GM more money. But then again, since when has GM did anything that makes any sence?? Mabee they'll consider it when not enough people don't take this buyout and they'll have to be like Ford and Chrysler and reopen the buyout program!

"GM ante-penultimate Next Big Thing, the Chevrolet Tahoe, continues to lose ground, dropping 34.2 percent from last March and 26.3 for the year."

That's through March folks. April is almost over.

To those who don't beleive that sales are the reason for the reduced production, read this:
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/by-the-...

Zoom-Yes to your guestion Janesville made trucks do go to the over-seas market.Big trucks may not sell as well in this area but they do in other parts of the US.There are companies that buy these trucks as FLEET TRUCKS.The days on hand number is a little misleading !!! As before on GM issues we need to agree to disagree !

E85 gives you LESS fuel economy. Ethanol has far less energy density than gasoline.

You get 28% fewer MPG than gasoline at 90% of the cost.

"Although proponents of E85 claim significant environmental benefits, research is showing that the growing and harvesting of corn in the US for use in E85 fuel is most likely damaging the environment and contributing to global warming. The use of food crops for fuel is also raising the price of food in the US and worldwide." -Wikipedia

Its too bad the buyouts didnt address the poeple with around 20 or so years in. These people have too much seniority to throw it away for cash and no benefits and not enough seniority to take an early retirement. I wish they could have come up with a plan for these poeple. As for the shift reduction, it doesnt come as much of a surprise, it has to do with the state of the economy, not the work force or age of the plant.

If this a big story. where is the local coverage (other than the Gazette). Nothing on the local news, nothing on CNN or CNN.com, Detroit Free Press has nothing about this other than the American Axle strike. Lets call this what it is. GM wants more buyouts. They were hoping for the same number they had last time. The AAM strike is affecting GM not doubt about it but I find it real hard to believe that this about gas prices and slow selling SUV's

diamond,
Does GM export the vehicles made in Janesville? If yes, has a global market made up for the decreased sales in the U.S.? The answer to that is no. Large vehicle sales are down for all manufacturers.

momof5,
I'm a little off topic here, but flex fuel won't save you money. What most people don't know is that E85 is, on avarage, 28% less efficient than regular fuel. The cheaper price of E85 doesn't offset the reduced fuel mileage. Also, that cheaper price is propped up by tax subsidies to ethenol producers, which ultimately means our tax dollars. Corn based Ethenol is a boondoggle.

That being said, at least you don't need to buy E85 to get better fuel efficiency.

Indeed its sad that people may lose their jobs or that the economic shockwave will ripple through all corners of Janesville and southern Wisconsin.

But ultimately it is GM who is at fault here. Toyota has taken the lead with more efficient vehicles in a time where fuel is at an all time high. Who in their right mind would purchase a Suburban with the MPG of an Oshkosh plow truck?

Indeed, you can all defend the great and wonderful GM... but hiring folks at $14/hr is nothing compared to closing the doors for good - so enjoy the job while you have it.

Long time gone-How has this president screwed the American worker? By signing NAFTA? Nope that was Clinton. Ask Oshkosh truck or any other vehicle maker what the war is doing for them. If you make a statement, back it up with some facts. What has our president done to screw the workers? And don't say $4.00 gas, that is a product of worldwide demand and our inability to drill for oil in Alaska and construct domestic refineries.

I have one of "these" trucks and I love it. Inside the door panel, it proudly states "assembled in Janesville." My Denali doesn't get any worse gas mileage than a Silverado, or even a Chrysler Town and Country..but the ~$4/gallon does sting. I really wish I still had access to the GMS discount because the new flex fuel Malibu's are pretty sharp, well priced and fuel efficient. Maybe this is all trickery, maybe it's not. But, if it is not, those who were so quick to gripe about GM will be wishing to have the old Jnesville and economy back in as short as 6 months from now! There will be upwards of 1000 less people in the greater Rock County area with 50% less disposable income.

Long_time_gone wrote: "Perhaps we keep the plant, and both shifts, working by slapping camo/sand paint on those SUVs and shipping them to Iraq."
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ROFLMBO!

localboy-The sales for these trucks have GONE UP for the over-seas market !GM NEEDS these trucks!!! What this story didn't say is Texas & Mexico will stay 2 shifts.Texas because it is a right to work state...Mexico low wages !!!One more thing localboy.. are you ONE of the GM haters? This WILL affect the ecomony in the area and beyond,this is more than JUST GM!!!

Denial aint just a river in Egypt. All the "this is a trick" folks need to look at the harsh realities. GM is losing money. GM can't sell large SUV's because of the high gas prices. Janesville is GM"s oldest plant. GM is more concerned about survival at this point than they are concerned about communities and individual workers. My reaction was "just one shift?" I can't believe the plant is even still open. The only good news is that the phase-out of jobs has been relatively gradual allowing the community to adjust. My advice: Take the buyout and take it fast.

I suspect a good percentage of everyone's suspicions are true - that GM is trying to provoke more buy-outs with half-truths as they did when my family was pursuaded to leave for Fort Wayne, AND their true goal is to replace those workers with lower wages.
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But the big question remains, can GM, even with those suspicions being true, can GM keep the doors open.
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This President has screwed the American worker beyond the impact of $4.00/gallon gas.
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Perhaps we keep the plant, and both shifts, working by slapping camo/sand paint on those SUVs and shipping them to Iraq.

Diamnondback - what do you suggest GM do in a situation like this? You seem to be very critical of thier handling of this market situation. GM is not hiding the fact they want lower wage employees when they first start with GM and are in "non-traditional" job assignments. The SAP (special attrition package) is just that. It is an agreement between GM and UAW for a minimum parachute if you wish to jump now. If in fact the economy springs back, what should GM do? Not supply the demand? Do you think they should hang on to all of the people and keep paying them until something great happens? I am really curious to your thoughts and plan you have worked out to handle this type of situation.

I really feel this is a trick !!! GM is sending notices to past summer help-temp workers asking IF they are interested in work,and if so to call a 800 # and update their information ...I just keep saying REMEMBER 84-85.What about all of the suppliers ??? The ONLY ones that will make any money on this deal are the bars and lawyers !!!

If GM continues it's downward spiral, it will do everything it can to stay viable. Unfortunately, the Janesville GM plant is now competing with two other GM plants to make a vehicle that is downward sales slope, probably permanently.

I guess it's better than the other half of this rumor I heard on Friday...that GM was closing down all together after the July shutdown. The lesser of two evils I guess. I suspected this was coming but having been around UAW related "rumors" much of my life, I had grown accustom to shaking things off. Something struck me as funny about this and I wasn't able to shake this "rumor" off. Even so, I'm just shocked!

A gift when compared to losing your job and getting nothing.

it doesn't happen often....but I'm officially speechless! I don't know what to say!

The buyouts are a gift?

Frankly, I think things are much worse than the corporation will ever admit. No company wants the buying public to lose confidence in the product they are building.

uuuhh...Of course GM wants people to take the buyouts, and pay new workers lower wages. I'm not sure what your point is. Are you suggesting that people should skip the buyout and hope they don't get laid off permanently? Frankly, the buyouts are a gift.

GM is trying to stimulate buyouts with workers. They want to get rid of the workers so badly that I am surprised that they are not chasing them out of the plant with a stick.

What will GM do after they get people to cut ties ? In July say oh no we made a mistake we will have 2 shifts !!! Welcome new hires at $14.00 . I hope people REMEMBER all the lives changed in 84-85 when they were told take the jobs in Fort Wayne or be out of a job !!!

The "rummor" was true !!! Hold on to your shorts !!! Is this the trick that they played in 84-85 ??? Does GM want the workers to take the buyout to hire new employees at $14.00 ???