That is a good point,kty. Really? What would the world be like if every one were the same? And honestly,if there were more people such as angelwings in the world,well,we wouldnt need organizations,would we?

justsome1here, why is it that when you start something that someone has done, or is doing similarly, that you must combine with them? The free stuff sale is not something that is duplicated. Yes there is services out there that do something like it, but not exactly. There are elements to it that are truely unique that make it in itself special and different from the others. I don't think we should tell people, stop what you are doing because someone else it already doing something similar and your time would be better spend with them. That is the one thing that I really don't understand. I would never tell my child don't grow up to start a business or charity for that matter becuase there is one like it in the same city. Good things take hard work to make happen and are worth the work. I commend each other entity out there doing similar things, but there is no reason for the free stuff sale to stop or combine, and they have already colaborated and have helped other entities. If you read my blog earlier you would have noticed that they are working with the city to make it a win/win situation. I am pleased that you are concerned and would like to see that it get a better location, please let the city know and ask them to work with them to find a better location. It can be the start of something great, all it takes is people willing to stand up for what they believe in.

Kellie,thank you so much ! You really are a kind person and I think many people could learn a good lesson from you.Have a great Christmas and give all of you a big hug from me and my family !

My name is Kellie Everhart. I am one of the hundreds of familys who these ANGELS have touched. Lets just all take a minute to give thanks to the wonderful giving people in our communitywho have done anything and everything they can to help. This is a time for giving, and to look at our lives and see the blessings in our own lives,is the fact that there are people who want to help really worth all this negativeness? GOD Bless you all!!! and happy holidays

kty1309 - I don't think anyone is saying that this is not a needed service. In fact, several posters have given names of organizations that already provide this service. What is apparent is that it has now outgrown the present location and therefore needs a more appropriate location. If the idea is to serve those in need then the best solution would be to pool resources with those that already offer these services. It in no way would diminsh what has already been done.

kty... u r my hero....

kty, Well put !

For everyone's information there is NO city ordiences on rummage sales. There is a policy that they will look into complaints issued. If a complaint is issued they will follow up with a form for home occupation application. This could happen to anyone holding rummage sales several weeks in a row to several times a year, the factor is the complaint. The city council is aware of the situation and has asked the City of Janesville to work with the free stuff sale to make it a win/win situation for all involved. They are very informed about the poverty in Janesville and of this free stuff sale. With General Motors last day being today, more people are going to be in need of things and won't qualify for the help. It is our job as a community to step up. If you are not in favor of the free sale ask yourself, what else can I do to help? For those out there who don't have the money, you have your time and effort, please put it to good use. We should be using this forum to challenge others to step up and help, not to knock each other down.

While this is a good thing to do it's time to move it to a more appropriate location.

I deserved it. Hannah's rude and poorly written posts put me over the top.

Wonder if tjncj was "showing her level of maturity" now.

I believe her.

etown...

We have all done it... Lay off her, PLEASE.

hannah- yeah im SURE that all those CAPS were by ACCIDENT. i mean, who WOULDNT believe YOU?

Regardless, it falls under a "garage sale" regulation. They certainly aren't going to post an officer there to be sure no one slips her money for the duration of the multiple "sales". (And let me just say, I am absolutely NOT saying this is happening!) One can advertise it as anything... but there has to be regulations to keep others from doing something similar, with less than moral thoughts. My mind could come up with so many scenarios of abuse... there is good cause for the ordinances.

That said, if she can find a better location, it would be a win/win situation. I would love to see her be able to keep this going, just NOT in a residential neighborhood, zoned for HOUSING, with all the issues that have caused problems for the neighborhood.

As far as the neighbors, many have been there for decades... how is it fair to disrupt the local environment and comfort level of these people who have raised generations of kids?
The best of intentions can have the worst impact on those around us.

The name calling, which has been abundant here, is totally unnecessary. Respect needs to take the upper hand... understand, there are two sides to every story.

I missed allot....



Heads up... Shopping was a pain in the butt today.....


What are we arguing about?

Hannah tends to get a bit hysterical at times. If I were Joanna, I would ask her to tone it down a bit.

hanna, please don't yell. If you want a constructive discussion you will need to change your tone.

hanna, there is nothing to defend. It is a good cause, brewers already acknowledged this. Please read through the discussion to see the valid concerns that were expressed.

You are really putting a thorn into the whole situation by asking questions that have already been answered in a thoughtful and positive way.

Thanks Nascar & Just--I truly don't know what I have done to upset her...other than disagree with her.

hannah - I have to agree with other posters . . if you have a personal vendetta against someone please take it off line.

How many times do we have to go over this??? The reason we got upset was this went on 3 (as in 1, 2, 3) weekends in a ROW. There IS an ordinance about rummage sales being held often. No, it's not enforced unless someone complains.

we would NOT have had a problem with it if it went on sporadically/occassionally.

as I have said before, if it were quarterly, that would be great.

BTW--if indeed you do have drug dealers in your neighborhood--why don't you apply some of your excess energy to getting RID of them??? Call the PD every time you see something--sooner or later they WILL catch them & it will stop.

instead of complaining (a lot in many different blogs) about it--DO something to help change the situation.

Now, before you attempt to turn my words against me, that is what I HAVE been doing. I have been working with the City to find an arrangement that will work for all of us.

HUH??? sorry brewers, I'm at work??? What's that mean?

I'm sure you won't consider it a good reason, but we do not agree with her location. It doesn't belong in a neighborhood.

Actually, since this all started, we have dug around & found stuff in the dark reaches of our closets--and taken it all to Goodwill.

Wow Hanna, take a chill pill.

Your posts just negated all the good that was happening in this blog. If you can't contribute to the cause then you should just leave it be.

Maybe you are right. Maybe there are friends bringing people. My point [again] is that NO ONE KNOWS.

We live about 1.5 blocks from a bus route. The point I was attempting to make is there hasn't been a lot (any?) bus passengers arriving. The other locations that assist people are also OPEN more than just weekends.

The buses do not operate on Sundays.

Any excess we have goes to Goodwill. Always has, always will.

I also wrote that we have noticed two of our neighbors did go over & stay for a very short time. I am certain we all thought it was a rummage sale when it first started.

Again, Hannah, you are calling me names--why the bitterness & venom filled posts?

the reason I mentioned that they didn't tell/ask us before doing this was I was asked if we had ever complained to JoAnn. Of course you don't have to ask/tell your neighbors before you do something--however, it is the nice thing to do, especially if it impacts them for more than a day.

brewersrock, I understand everything you are saying, and agree with you.

I agree that unfortunately there are people that will ( and probably already have) taken advantage of this give away. I also did not assume that you were uninformed on financial hardships. Trust me I understand as well as anyone as my husband and I are also experiencing the same issues as many at this time.

I agree that someone could have a nice car & recently lost their job. My point is that there have been very, very few "beaters" coming to the giveaway. We are concerned that the people that may really need the free items do not even own a car, so they may not have been able to get to her house. Hopefully, the people in the late model vehicles really need what they are getting & are not taking them because they can & not because they need them.

I know I sound terribly cynical, but I work with disadvantaged people & I know some of the stunts that get pulled, like the earlier comment about the woman going from place to place claiming no help from any.

I also want to add that I have an un-employed spouse...has been for almost a year now. So I am not as un-informed about financial problems as some may have thought.

Brewersrock-I have to say just because someone has a newer vehicle does not mean they have not fallen on hard times. With so many losing jobs even those with newer vehicles are experiencing hard times right now. I'm not trying to bash you just point out that a newer car does not mean they are not in need of things at this time.

Yes, Mikki, there are reasons. Without going into detail, the most recent example in my experience was a woman attempting to go from location to location (in a neighboring community) to get multiple Christmas meals and gifts for children by saying she hadn't received anything from any other agency. Her attempts failed just because of record keeping, thereby saving some of these things for other families not already served. These incidents are not isolated, however-for the record-they are not attempted by most people in need, who are generally extremely grateful-and also generous themselves (in resources or time) when given the opportunity.
There is surely a kind heart behind this neighborhood giveaway, no doubt, but please don't say there are not genuine concerns (both personal and logical charitable concerns from some experienced people "in the field") behind the statements that are made by some here. Scrooges? That's really going too far. If the bigger, well established charities have to follow strict guidelines (licenses, codes...where a good portion of time is spent adhering to them) and this give-away wants to be a charity, why shouldn't they have to follow the same rules? Their "giving" rules are up to them, of course, like whether or not the person needs, or just wants. But the rest...

There are reasons that the charities have paperwork completed and keep databases of the people they have assisted.

SarahB, yes there is a house for sale on the same side of Pontiac as JoAnn, about 4 doors down.

That's definitely an important note to remember, Luluberry. She is giving these people gifts in a way. Is there an ordinance against that? Gosh, I hope not.

And... Some of the local charities are being selective of whom they give to... I think that one should put that into consideration before slamming what Angel is doing. She doesn't make them fill out paperwork or explain why they need these things, she just gives.

DevilTail: Thank you for taking the initiative here to create a more open discussion between what seems to have become two opposing sides in the issue. I also want to thank Brewersrock for giving the detailed explanation of why this project is so bothersome to some of the neighbors.

Yes...I believe it is over for the time being. Hopefully, in the spring she will be able to have a weekend event...with the city's approval. I do believe everyone has learned from this. Communication...communication...communication.

Thank you brewersrock for this discussion...more has been accomplished in these latest posts...then was in all others.

ok, that was something (overwhelmed) I know I hadn't thought of. it's over for now (isn't it) so that's good.

You are right...they did not talk to any of the neighbors. The fact that an "eyesore" was created, I am sure could have been resolved.

With the number of people in need...the current charities are overwhelmed. They can not handle the volume of needy people out there. You see it in the paper all the time. Duplication of charities only opens the door to more people being helped. I feel that the neighhood concept...ordinary people helping others is an excellent way of doing this. Just so you know, Joanne has been contacted by some of these charities. Some being supportive, none being critical. Some asking her for help when they couldn't fullfill a particular need. I am very happy to say...she was able to do it.

remember they did not come to any of us before this started. I agree it's a interesting idea, but there are other places already established in town that do the same thing in a better location--why duplicate? why not work together?

I think what most of us objected to the most is the tarps & the fact that this occurred three consecutive weekends. IF it happened once a quarter, it would be better...not perfect, but better.

Other organizations have appropriate parking, insurance, easy access--why not work with them? they are also located on bus routes and open at times where those that need this most can access their services. is it a good idea to under-cut these services?

brewersrock - finally...a discussion. Although 20/20 hindsight is always the clearest way to see things, when the tarps went up, and stayed up...is when I think I would have tried to talk with them...and maybe offer some helpful suggestions...not critizism. Most people, when critizied, dig their heels in...and very little can be accomplished. I do support what she is doing...and would like her to be able to continue. I hope the city does not shut her down...the seasonal concept hopefully will be more to everyone's liking.

perhaps. However, by the time we realized what was going on, the tarps were up, the news camera was here & in our opinions, it was too late to do anything. we thought it was a rummage sale originally.

brewersrock - Thank you for your honesty, and discretion. Like I said before, I am Joanne's friend. However, I too might have many of those same concerns if all those problems in my neighborhood. I agree with you that there is a right and wrong way of doing things. I do believe, though, that if you had approached Joanne, and talked to her face to face, many of these issues could have been resolved.

I do not know if other neighbors talked to them about this or not. I know we observed two different neighbors go over there the second weekend & only stay for a short time, I do not know what transpired.

No, we did not approach them. We have our reasons, which I am unprepared to share. I know I will get blasted for that, but we do have a very, very good reason.

and...we have not ONLY complained online. We have contacted the City. There is a "right" way & a "wrong" way to do things & we believe in the legal process & so that is how we approached it.

I know that is not the answer you or others want & I am certain some will find us at fault. Perhaps we are.

Brewersrock - you have some excellent points. I too would probably be very concerned if I experienced all those problems. What I would like to know is...did you or any of the other complaining neighbors ever go to Joanne and in a neighborly way, express your concerns? If I were in their situation, I would appreciate the direct, face to face discussion instead of complaining about the problems in a blog.

hate to burst your bubble, but what we observed was for every SUV, mini-van, or pick-up arriving with stuff to drop off, only to see another late model SUV, van, truck LEAVE with 'free stuff' loaded in it. There were some "beaters" but by far, the majority of vehicles that have been here have been late models & better shape than what we drive--or better than Joanne & Jared drive! It seems that people that most need free stuff probably can't afford the expense of owning a car so therefore are unable to get here, to this neighborhood to GET the free stuff.

kind of hard NOT to watch this as it has gone on for 4 weekends & if we are in our living room...we have a large window looking out onto Pontiac Drive.

SaraB--you wanted to know the other side--here goes:

this started out to be a one weekend event. it turned out to be multiple, consecutive weekends. it increases traffic on an already busy street, causes parking problems in front of all of our houses & in some cases, driveways, increases litter (espescially cigarette butts), increases all of our risk of personal injury liability due to increase of foot traffic, was an visual eyesore of used furniture, garbage bags of clothing & multiple colored tarps (wind barriers) being left up for weeks at end.

we observed on several occassions, young children running into/across the street & several 'close calls' due to speeding traffic.

we agree this is a GREAT idea--just not in a residentially zoned area.

there have also been problems with 'free stuff' customers walking in their lawns. one neighbor in particular has a lovely yard & did not appreciate the foot traffic.

while non of these things are HUGE on their own, when you add them up, they are inconsiderate. we shouldn't have to ask people to move so we can get out of our own driveway...that happened every weekend & more than once each day.

if it is reduced to 3 or 4 times a year, that's fine--as long as the tarps stay down--and it is not on consecutive weekends.

someone commented that their neighbors never warned/asked them about graduation parties... I'm sorry to hear that--that is not a good neighbor. When we have had parties, we have not only warned our immediate neighbors, but we have INVITED them--as they have done when they have had parties that may annoy us.

As one of the people that donated coats for the impoverished... It was probably me and others that were GIVING not receiving in our late model cars. Kinda creepy thinking of you looking out your window at people.....

"Scrooge" here. I am ONE of the multiple neighbors that have complained. This weekend's event was not very busy, there were no children running wild, so it was not a problem--thank you, JoAnne if you asked folks to watch their children crossing the street. We HAVE noticed that there seem to be a great deal of late model SUVs, F150s & other late model & expensive vehicles. We wonder if these folks really need a free sweatshirt.

Another thought--we also noticed that, while we live close to a bus route, there were no bus-riding passengers (we watched)...which again makes us wonder if the folks that really could use the free stuff but do not have a vehicle OR can afford to buy the newspaper/own a computer are actually being helped.

No matter what the outcome is concerning "Free Stuff" at Angels and Wings, I see a huge amount of good that has happened. No only the totally unexpected number of people Joanne has helped, but also...we are seeing the names of other organizations, most I have never heard of, that help the needy at no cost. This too is very good.

Maybe to get around the ordinance she could have a rummage sale and have everything priced for a penny.

Okay, help us better understand where the neighbors are coming from on this issue. I am a renter now, but when I lived in Iowa, I owned my own condo. Even as a once-owner of property, I cannot come up with long-term consequences on what Ms. Higgins is doing. Please help me see your point, gmof3. And I also don't understand the point you objectors keep making about her needing to be a good neighbor. Doesn't that go both ways?

Rock Responds is an organization that consists solely of non-profits. IT does not allow individuals to subscribe. The thought is that by being a client of one of the non-profits (Rock County human services, CPS, Jobcenter, Echo, Exchange Family Resource Center) that you are "needy". As an employee of these organizations, we are told to choose carefully whose needs are listed on this site. We list people that really NEED items (a bed for a child, clothing for a new job, etc). Unfortunately, it only goes out to employees of these organizations. And, yes, GM was a great provider of needs- JoAnn that used to be in the child resource area was an INCREDIBLE asset to this community!

gmaof3 - you sound very angry. I take it that you too are a neighbor. If that is the case, I stand corrected. However, to the best of my knowledge Joanne has not been running a retail outlet. Also, to the best of my knowledge, she has not done anything outside of the law. When the controversy first started, she contacted the city, and was told that at the time, no laws were being broken.

I got the impression from what angelwings posted on her website that there were complaints from the neighbors - which implies more than one.
Also, working things out requires compromise from both (or all) parties involved.

No, its not just 1 neighbor...
This is a residential neighborhood, not retail.
A-OK is already serving this need, and would certainly appreciate the help Joanne could offer.

The silly comment about buying houses in the neighborhood to help her, she rents, she doesn't own. The consequences of her actions won't really affect her in the long run. It does affect the neighborhood however.

There's no argument that she's helping others, but one would think she would want to be compliant and a good neighbor. You can't have it both ways. Help the needy but to h@!! with the law.

For all, contact United Way's First Call, and ask how to get in on the Rock Responds.
This is an e-mail alert system that people will posts needs and give-aways of items.
I don't know the criteria for signing up to be part of the e-mail chain, but I know GM was a part of it.
For example, a homeless person is getting a new apartment and needs furniture. Perhaps you have an old dresser you don't want. The connection will be made.

Although I may be wrong...It is my understanding that only one neighbor has been complaining about this project. If that really is the case...doesn't it seem like what Joanne is doing isn't so bad for the neighborhhod? Wouldn't it be better if that neighbor were to work with Joanne, and attempt to come up with a way to work out their differences instead of trying to stop Joanne from helping those who so very much need the help?

Doesn't ECHO do this same sort of give-away?

Sorry - "empathize"

Apparently in this city, people only respect other people when they agree with them. The people posting here obviously have no respect for the people who feel that this has become a problem for them. Respect IS a two way street, but so apparently is disrespect. I can totally empthaize with the neighbors. It seems that this has outgrown what it originally was intented for (one time) and therefore a more appropriate location would better suit it. There is nothing disrespectful about that. Just common sense.

deborah21154

What is really going on is that these Scrooges are worried about their property values... They wouldn't care if people were PAYING for what they were taking... They just don't like poor people walking anywhere near their houses... Quite sad

It really saddens me to see neighbor complaining about something like this. I have yet to be asked by any neighbor for approval for them to hold outdoor parties for graduations, different holiday celebrations, birthday parties, etc. Yet the street in front of my house is occupied by vehicles attending their function.. my yard is invaded by their company and not just walking across it. I have the loud talking, kids and adults yelling, loud music blasting and usually as the day wears on... drunken behavior as well. Just wondering if it's necessary for a permit for the family and friend gatherings like this?

Yes, but how is what she is doing this weekend being disrespectful? I have driven past the location multiple times in the past two days and have not seen more than a couple of cars there at one time, no tarps, no junk in the driveway, no crowds, no kids running through the streets, no trash scattered across lawns or blowing in the streets, no loud noises, etc. Respect is a two-way street. Let's say I don't like the smell of meat grilling on an outdoor grill, does that mean nobody should be allowed to grill in the summer out of respect for me?

So, what's the difference? Why should she have to worry about what the neighbors think? Janesville is a city that believes they are wealthy, that there are no 'poor' people here.

I fully support this endeavor as it is also a way for those that do think Janesville is made of money to see the reality of it-- there are poor people living here that can't afford to even go the the thrift shops such as Goodwill and Salvation Army.

Is there a problem with this family doing what is necessary to care for others in their community? I think not!

My suggestion for you, Joanne, is to talk with Amy Loasching of the city council. There are a couple of them (as reported in the Gazette) that are looking to raise the awareness of poverty within this community.

Joanne, I would love to help you out in this endeavor of loving thy neighbor!

Although I agree with this in spirit, in reality this person lives in a residential neighborhood and with that should come the responsibility of being respectful of other people that live there.

Does anyone have an electric stove to give? I know of a family that really needs one bad. If you have one please leave contact info on our website.Thank you.

I am saddened that there is any controversy regarding this. Joanne Higgins is a gracious person and she deserves our praise and gratitude.

I am a friend of angelwings, and very proud of it. When she called me a few days prior to the first event, I was not surprised that she had this idea. It was so her.... Now that it has taken off so successfully, I wish her the best of luck with the city. To stop or limit this sort of activity would certainly, in my view be a blackeye to the city of Janesville. Yes, I understand the traffic problem on Pontiac Dr. Yes, I understand the rights of the neighbors. However, as she has told me, she now plans to limit her personal give-a-ways to seasonal events, perhaps 4 times a year. But, by useing her website www.freestuffatangels.org she can continue to help those in need year round, and help organize other "Free Stuff" events around the area. What I believe she has done is started a 'grass roots" movement by showing that just an average person can make a HUGE difference when it comes to helping someone in need. 'Good Luck' Joanne...you will always have my support.

Proartist- While I agree with you on some level, I must say that you must also consider the good (a cold child receiving a coat) vs. the bad (grass stepped on, noise, etc.). The neighbors comments and attitude are what have earned them the "ill will". JoAnn is NOT RESPONSIBLE for the comments and actions of her neighbors, and, should not be expected to pre-emptively anticipate what their actions will be. The neighbors hold responsibility for themselves. Furthermore the good of the cold being warmed far out weighs the cosmetic and the selfish......

Nothing warms the heart more than such a charitable gesture on the part of the organizer, Ms. Higgins, and those who donate to the free rummage.

The old adage that "nothing in life is free" is far too true. The problem with endeavors such as this comes from the fact too many refuse to realize what their goodwill may often "cost" others. Before volunteering for any endeavor with any person/organization, ask yourself if your actions will, in any manner, harm others in real (property terms or creating dangerous situations) or even in simple verbal malicious malignment (as has happened to too many residential neighbors in Janesville). When considering these issues, you'll quickly realize there can be a huge cost to someone else who, by no fault of their own, is involuntarily involved. In this case, there's a truly amazing benefit to the consumers and lots of fame and pride to the host, but harm to existing charitable endeavors and open ill-will directed toward neighbors, as well as the neighborhood-at-large. Planned "give-aways" multiple times a year in the same place are far more than simple yard sales. For the benefit of all in the community free-for-alls must be in properly zoned areas with adequate crowd control, in collaborative communication with those who will be directly affected by the action, with conscious management to avoid legal issues, and with the most serious consideration of all the costs.

Here is the website:

http://freestuffatangels.org/drupal/

And, I agree. I don't have a workable garage, but, would be happy to do it in my driveway once it gets a bit warmer.... And, MY neighbors agree with me and want to "pitch in"... Thank GOD I live where I do!

I would be willing to have one of these "free stuff" sales in my garage, just so the neighborhood of Higgins can relax and it would move to a different part of town. Does anyone know if there is a website for this?

When I first got wind of the Free Sale, I was so excited and thrilled to see such a wonderful gesture take fruition. My first thought was that this would be similar to "pay it forward', and that the whole city would want to get involved and do similar free sales. It's so disappointing to see that it only caused a war about property rights and permits. I guess it's true. "No good deed goes unpunished". I'm proud of Angelwings for "doing it anyway". I wish more people had her drive and determination. It's dangerously cold out today. I wonder how it feels to those without a coat.