lakennedy, I was referring to 4-year colleges in general, not UW-Madison specifically. I would guess that admision standards for UW-Madison are reasonably high, although I do remember past stories about UW-Madison admitting students they expect to drop out after a few years, just so they can get the tuition. The reason I mentioned this is that graduating from a 4-year college used to be a fairly rare and valuable thing, and of course people wanted more young people to do so. Now the statistics of young people graduating college are up drastically, but many argue that the main reason (NOT the only reason) for this increase is not that more young people are getting better educations, but that more colleges are reducing their requirements and dumming down their classes to allow more students through, which brings in revenue/makes them feel good about themselves.

biggirl mentioned that some CEOs of corporations say they'd prefer a 4-year degree over a more practical one because they want a flexible workforce (first of all, I wasn't ruling out all 4-year degrees, some of which are very practical). While that may be true, it's also true that many employers who have been around for a few decades have observed that fresh college graduates aren't nearly as qualified as fresh college graduates used to be in the past, even from the same schools. More employers are now requiring masters degrees or even PhDs where in the past the job requirements would have only included a BS degree.

The bottom line I'm trying to say is that there seems to be a stigma today that if you don't get a 4-year degree you're not getting a good education, and I think that's complete nonesense. Some people are well suited to getting a 4-year degree (interest, specific field, finances), but its not for everyone, and you shouldn't think less of yourself if you feel better suited to going to Blackhawk or U-Rock and getting a technical degree, or later transferring as others have mentioned.

When is the last time you applied to UW-Madison? "...(because the admittance standards are so low)" You must either be a genius, or kidding.

I went to UW-Rock (hard to break the habit of dropping the W) but I also went to a four-year liberal arts college. The UW Centers are not just oriented toward two-year degrees; many students later go on to attend one of the four-year campuses in the UW System (especially Whitewater and Madison) or another college entirely. It is better to think of the Centers as providing adult education (which they do in significant numbers) than as an "alternative" to a bachelor's degree. That is a role served more explicitly by the Technical College system, even if some of them, like Blackhawk, have broadened their curricula.

I am glad to see U-Rock attendance up. I know that in the last few years I have had more and more students opt for URock for their first year or two (satisfy their breadth requirements), really get a feel for where they want to go and what they want to do, and then they transfer to an appropriate 4 year university to finish their degree since the credits are transferable...AND they have saved a ton of money on tuition and room and board!

What is stupid is to think that a four-year Liberal Arts degree should be practical in the narrow sense. The average worker will now have 11 jobs in his or her lifetime; thus, any education cannot be seen narrowly as training. Students need a good all-around education, including in reading and writing skills, something that is often much better achieved in the Liberal Arts. I have no problems with training in trades, but I think it is a grave mistake to turn our education into a training program for jobs that will disappear. Last time I looked for example, UW-Rock had instituted a 4-year "engineering" program geared toward the automobile manufacturing. I wonder what the students can do with that degree now? Move to Japan? How much better would it have been if they had a well-rounded Liberal Arts degree in any subject that assured they could read, analyze written documents, write documents, and develop critical thinking skills. Oh, by the way, if we're being practical here, I would also note that most CEOs of major corporations said they'd prefer such a degree over a more seemingly practical one because they want a flexible workforce.

This is good. I'd love to see more attendance at UW-Rock and Blackhawk, which for the most part teach you practical work skills. I think too many kids have this idea in their head that they have to go to a 4-year college, and then they either flunk/drop out (because the admittance standards are so low) or graduate college with some useless degree like Women African Storytelling. Its far better to do well learning a good-paying trade job than to do poorly or mediocre learning a high-end or frivolous job.

But to be fair, I will admit that I went to a 4-year college for engineering.