A moniker like "truth" and he/she says that evolution has "been all but disproven." (is disproven even a word?) That's the best one I've heard in years!! Science obviously means nothing to this person! The 16th century is alive and well in Janesburg!

Whats with this "gene pool" nonsense??..This is some of the most ignorant garbage I have seen.

If you're coming from the perspective that people "evolved from lower life forms", forget it...That has been all but disproven.

to all of you tromping down on charter schools: while I dont know about the quality of charter schools in your area I do know about the ones in my area. they do much more work and go longer then public schools in our areas plus the students actually learn. in arizona most of the public schools are failing and some parents decided to do something about it so they started charter schools that the public schools or states do not interfere with that have longer class time and much more work. and if you graduate from a charter school here your diploma will actually look better then a public high school diploma here. now that saying the educational system here really needs an overhaul.

pizzaman - Not sure who "those people" are. For all I know, you are one of them.

JTMEK-I'm also proud to say when my cousin turned 18 she moved out of her parents house in with my aunt & uncle who have been supportive of her, she will graduate spring, has a good job and is a productive, law abiding member of our community. Unfortunately not every child in such a bad situation will be so fortunate. I think our community needs to be aware of such situations and hence is the reason I have posted "my dilemma".

JTMEK-Good for your child that he/she is a good, law abiding citizens Obviously you've been a supportive parent. Not every child has that luxury. Some parents just don't care how their children turn out. Believe me, the rest of our family are law abiding citizens. Unfortunately for my cousin, her parents thought they were done raising her when she could dress for herself at about age 5. They made sure she ate, was clothed, and had a bed to sleep in that really was about as far as their parenting went past age 5. They care more about drinking and having a good time.

Sometimes the grass is burnt on the other side........

I personally know someone who went to Charter and did an outstanding job. She couldn't go to Craig or Parker. She couldn't stand the larger classrooms, or all of the people. She simply could not do it... not because of behavioral reasons, but just because she wasn't comfortable. She was the best student in her class at Charter. She graduated from Charter and went on to college. Right now she's working two jobs, trying to get as many hours as she can at each. She just bought a brand new car, and is really doing something with her life. Without Charter, she wouldn't be there. That's one person's life that Charter saved. That's enough for me. There can be 1,000 more students that pass through those doors, and not one of them changes... but I know that at least one person had a dramatic change. It's not right for all of you to shun it so. It's not fair for you to say that my friend shouldn't be where she is today, because people try to take advantage of Charter.
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One last thing.... have any of you ever seen the process involved in trying to get enrolled in charter? They don't take just any body. They have limited spaces, and are very picky about who they allow to enroll. They try to use their best judgment to see who could actually benefit and succeed.
Remember, the grass is always greener on the other side. But don't let the green grass fool you.

Now onto the Charter school discussion...
They say the grass is always greener on the other side. So some students think that Charter is the easy way out? They might not have to go to school until the afternoon. Maybe they can go to school in the morning, and get the whole afternoon off. Teachers work with the students more and in turn it makes homework and tests easier.
Allow me to share an experience I had, when I thought the grass was greener on the other side. When I was in sixth grade, I never did much of my homework. My grades slipped, and this threw up some flags for the school admin. I'm wasn't a dumb kid... fairly smart, really. I was offered to join a program called the PASS program. I can't remember what it stood for, but it was designed, much like Charter, to help students with special needs. I thought, "Hey! Cool, I can do even less work now! Awesome!" At first it was alright.. I got to take tests with a smaller group of kids, and even had some help from one of the PASS teachers if I ever needed it on tests. Then, when I wasn't doing my homework, they started to make me stay late. I remember too many times being at school until after the sun went down. I also wasn't allowed to take German that year because it didn't fit the PASS program's schedule. I'd wanted to take German ever since third grade, so this was a crushing blow. Later in the year, students were offered the opportunity to take a test to see if they could take pre-algebra for eighth grade (a high school level class). It was designed to help kids get ahead in their education, so they could take the tougher classes in high school. I couldn't take that test though, because I was in the pass program. It made me disqualified, automatically. After seventh grade I dropped out of the PASS program, I told them I could make it on my own. I still couldn't take German, because I was too late. Half way through my eighth grade, the normal math class was way too easy for me, and I asked my teacher if I could join the pre-algebra class. She told me if I could catch up before the new semester, I could. I caught up to half a school year's work in two weeks. That's all it took me... two weeks. The PASS program is a great program, designed for kids with special needs. In joining it, though, you lose a lot of opportunities that you otherwise might have had. I didn't get to take German until my freshman year. Since then I've been able to live out my dream and I traveled there twice. Imagine if I stayed in that, "the grass is greener" mentality though. Do you think they offer German at Charter? They don't. They don't offer a lot of classes at Charter that you could take going to Craig or Parker.

Alright, enough is enough.
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Proartist,
I PERSONALLY worked with the recruiters in Janesville. I'm not a recruiter, but I did work with them. You have been misinformed. The recruiters DO NOT have access to personal files. How would I know this, aside from my experience working with the recruiters? Because I enlisted in the Marine Corps myself. I had to do a lot of foot work and sign a lot of papers in order for the recruiters to get the information they needed. They simply are NOT allowed to get transcripts, or any other personal information on students aside from a name, phone number, and address. As you have pointed out, students can even opt out of this. It's very frustrating for a recruiter to call a number, just to ask if someone is interested in joining, and then get yelled at. Furthermore, while working with the recruiters, I noticed that the recruiters from all branches network. If one gets a "no" answer, they pass the word to their co-workers (most of the time). It saves them time. There are roughly 450 students in each class for Parker and Craig. Recruiters start at Juniors. That means that between just those two schools, the recruiter has a list of 1,800 names and numbers. They DO NOT try over and over to get someone to join, if they said no. It simply is not worth wasting time on. They might call back in a year, this is true. Next time, pay more attention to who is calling. It's possible that last month it was the Air Force, and this month it was the Army. Maybe one reason you are getting calls is because your child told the recruiter that he or she was interested. Stop being so over protective... you have to let your kids grow up sooner or later. I'm getting out after one term of enlistment... but I do not for one second regret joining the military. I've learned a lot and grown up a lot from when I was in high school.

Yea...I'll get Evert's job and then eventually retire to Nevada. Good plan. JK

pizzaman - Have you really taken a genetics class?
" Natural selection is the process by which favorable heritable traits become more common in successive generations of a population of reproducing organisms, and unfavorable heritable traits become less common. Natural selection acts on the phenotype, or the observable characteristics of an organism, such that individuals with favorable phenotypes are more likely to survive and reproduce than those with less favorable phenotypes. The phenotype's genetic basis, genotype associated with the favorable phenotype, will increase in frequency over the following generations."

Simon should set a goal of becoming Janesville Superintendent of Schools when Evert leaves in a few years. He or she certainly has all the answers! Anything from gangs at Parker to that nasty charter school. Just as simon....and low and behold....simon says!

Every kid in every school goofs off at some time. Of course, most do not cause the trouble that these youths do, but even Janesville's public schools are not pre-Ivy League or overly demanding of their students. For example, how much real learning will take place at either high school on the snow-day Saturdays?

Honesty is sometimes harsh. I like your natural selection theory pizzaman.

Expell them to keep the others safe! These are young adults that we are talking about, and they know the difference between right and wrong. This situation has become more and more of a problem because of a few different issues. One reason we hear of this more is because there are a lot of parenting issues out there. They are not all because of bad parenting but because our society does not let us parent as our parents did. I'm not for beating your child but a smack on the butt once in awhile never hurt anyone. Another huge reason that Janesville and many other districts don't want to deal with these types of children is because of the "NCLB Act". The schools get graded on what they produce. The grades they get determince the amount of federal funds they receive. The act had great intentions but has led to things like this. Even if the NCLB act wasn't in place these kids have no purpose being in a public school. In the end kids now days are much different than most of us. They don't know what respect is and it is the fault of the society they live in. Unless changes are made at a larger level this will only continue to get worse.

Let's put it this way. Putting kids in a charter school for reasons other than special ed would be like stacking the deck of cards in the game Candyland to allow a child win. What happens when the child plays against someone who doesn't stack the deck for them? The outcome isn't the expected win! Just as life's deck isn't stacked...you need to work hard and take your chances that you may have try again.

Education is not required for students once they have been expelled. Unless, they are special ed students. Students have to apply to any of the alternative schools in Janesville. You are not automatically enrolled. Charter students definitely do not work as hard as a regular high school student. The hours alone show you that. Charter students punch in to complete the required number of hours required of them. In a regular school, you are there 7 + hours everyday. One is like a fulltime job and one is like a part-time job. The work may be the same difficulty level (although I know it is not) but the time committment is far less and much more flexible. This alone makes the program attractive to students that struggle in school. There is a definite need for these programs and they are great for many students but there are also some students that take the easy way out just because they can.

whybesad...AHMEN!

They may go somewhere else but, that doesn't mean they will change. The kid has issues bigger than being expelled. I'm guessing the next stop for the kid will be jail.

the_rude_1...I can see where you may have come to these conclusions by hear say. But whether people choose to believe it or not, a school can't just dismiss a "serious" problem because they don't want to deal with it. That would be a cause for a court proceeding. People tend to shift blame on schools when they refuse to see their little Johnny or little Jane may be a trouble maker. Usually these parents that refuse to admit the obvious are of "the same gene pool", and have excersised the same "it's not my fault..it's society's fault I am less than" philosophy. There are never absolutes, but there are averages, and the average student that attends these programs is a disruption in some way or another.

What's wrong with schools submitting names to recruiters, thekai? They don't just have access to "names". They have access to student FILES. Ever try to even get your OWN info from the schools? Why does the military have access to see records that even you would have to jump through hoops to retrieve? Why can they provide a career assessment exam to students without anyone knowing it's from the military? And, from experience, I can tell you even if you clearly tell recruiters "No", they keep calling and mailing and calling and mailing. I strongly urge everyone to ask for and complete the military "Opt Out" form early at the beginning of every school year for it must be done annually. Recruiters are granted access by force (i.e. the threat of elimination of all federal funding) to high schools that no other entity would ever even consider attempting. Isn't it enough young men are required by law to register when they're 18? Why can't the military wait until students are more mature and have a little bit more wisdom to realize what they might be in for if they enlist.

Ok first of all before you start saying that the kids at charter don't work as hard or harder than the kids that attend normal high school, you should know some of the kids that have gone there. I know many children that have went through that program and busted their butts. Some of these kids wouldn't get the normal chance to do this at school because they may have other problems that the Janesville school system like to sweep under the rug and I am not talking about girls having babies. This I know for a fact because my son was treated different for having a such problems. My niece went to charter and she did the work they gave her and that was more then she was getting when she was going to a Janesville high school. She wasn't pregnant or was she a trouble maker she was a student that they didn't want to deal, she was having trouble with another student and no matter what her mother did the school did nothing to stop it and my niece paid the price in her work and my sister moved her to charter. Just because you hear students talk about the Charter Program in a bad way doesn't mean that it is a breeze and a vaction for those kids.
This is why alot of people are moving there children out of the Janesville school system, because if you aren't the perfect child then Janesville doesn't want to deal with it.

DIAMONDBACK....I understand that you may have a different position on the charter schools, but I must clarify something to you. I have friends that actually WORK in the charter school system, and I know for a fact (in our district...not sure if this is universal, but I am thinking it is) that most children in these programs are tainted in some way or another. By tainted I mean "different" then the "traditional student". They are usually students that have broken the rules of a traditional school and have been sent to these schools so they don't disrupt other non-offensive students, and are given MUCH MORE help and easier curriculum than traditional H.S. students. They are given extra credits for the same classes. THis then also leads to a lower class rank for a student that is in H.S. because a charter student's grades, which are better than they should be, are averaged in their school district. This IS NOT fair to our children who abide by the rules and work hard for their success in school. Like many have said here, it is a goal of some to get into these charter schools. Why not? Then they all are in one spot together, and they don't feel as if they are different....and they don't have to work near as hard for a diploma because the staff feels sorry for these statistics. Once again rewarded for bad behavoir. Then a vicious cycle begins...as they enter the real world once again, they have no coping mechanisms, therefore, they end up on welfare and contribute to the crime that is rising, and get into more complex troubles than a fight in school. Granted, some probably do turn around, but I am apt to believe that most don't, and once again, these children will grow up with the excuses of a bad childhood. I truly believe they should be placed in a military type school, so it is not "cool" to get into trouble.

There is absolutely NO WAY that any student that goes to a Janesville charter school works as hard or harder than a student attending high school at Craig or Parker. Anyone who believes this really doesn't have a clue. My kids hear others talk about going to charter from the minute they get into high school; it is actually a goal some have. Thus, they make it miserable for the other students at school and in the classroom.

What's amazing to me is how many people don't know what's going on. Continue burrying your heads in the sand and thinking this is an isolated incident.

I HATE that pretty much anyone that doesn't want to go to school all day because they would rather be out smoking weed or has gotten in some trouble can just go to the Charter School and get the same diploma that I will get for graduating from an actual high school. In my opinion is if you want to get a high school diploma you have to go to a high school and not take the easy way out.

Hey simon....are you an employee of Parker High School? Or are you just guessing? It is always amazing to me how many people who are not at all involved seem to know so much about what is going on in the schools.

What's wrong with schools submitting names to recruiters? They have a job to do, and that's to recruit the future defenders of our country. Do you have any idea how much work a recruiter has to do just to contact everyone on that list? If you tell the recruiter you aren't interested, he isn't going to waste his time trying to convince you anyways. And here's a little hint to all of you... 90% of the time, the recruiter will ask someone who has already enlisted if he or she knows any of the people on the list, and if any of them are at all likely to enlist. It would take too much work to call every single number.

Anyways, I've gotten off topic... I just hate to see the military get a bad rep when they do nothing wrong.

I'd say, considering the fact that these kids are still young and could turn their lives around, it's better that their names are not published. Sometimes people make bad decisions... young people are very good at that, which explains why we don't have a permanent record until we feel they should be mature enough to make responsible choices.

For the most part, I think the Charter school is great. It allows some kids the opportunity to continue their education despite great difficulties, it gives other kids a fair chance to turn their lives around and still graduate high school, and it meets the special needs of other students who, for one reason or another, Craig or Parker can not meet. I know a few people who have gone to Charter, and I am very thankful for its existence.

wishabone, I understand your dilemma but here is my dilemma. Why should a student that breaks the law, drugs, fights, gangs, etc. have a chance to stay in school and jeopardize my child's education who chooses to not break the law?

The sad thing is unless the parents decide to home school these kids or try to enroll them in the Charter alternative school, these kids get absolutely no education. My cousin was expelled for drug possession and sat at home for almost 2 years sitting around because her parents felt that the books for home school were too expensive. Finally after almost 2 years she was enrolled at Charter after much prodding from other family members. I know these kids are definitely in the wrong, how are they supposed to improve themselves when they are thrown out of school like trash with no follow-up even from a social worker?

Here is a perfect oportunity for the cane!!Line em up and bend em over for all the students to see!! 20 whacks apiece. And do'nt forget the smelling salts. Thats the essential part. After they pass out , you have to "wake them up" so they can appreciate the whole experiance!!!!!!! Bring in a 6'5' 350# lineman and let him go at em . This would give all students a chance to learn about punishment from other parts of the world. It could be like global studies up close and personal.

The fight was at Parker between rival gang members. Gang membership among Parker students is on the rise.

Why is it that the Janesville Gazette only looks at expulsions in Janesville. Kids get expelled from schools all over the Gazette's circulation area, and yet they don't cover it! Look at Delavan, Milton, and the rest of the school district.

i truely believe that even if they could print the names and pictures that the gazette would opt to not do it. just another case of denying our right to know who these trouble makers are and who the non-caring failure parents are. or maybe it is to keep us from grasping a TREND developing with certain groups of students. who in their right mind wants to send their child to school or anywhere without them and the child knowing who the dangerous people are. if the parents had any guts they would put a big sign on the child and stand them on milton avenue for a couple week-ends acknowledging their bad behavoir. when will we ever understand that expulsion and probation are worn like a badge of honor. i say only discipline in front of the student body and making them cry in front of their friends is the way to really have an affect on them. my guess is that school uniforms would cut way down on school violence. i think the "no child left behind" had good intentions. with the problem students and those who refuse to stay abreast of their studies it should become "let's leave the loafers behind". any child who is giving a good effort but for some reason is falling behind we should have a slower, more focused school for them. let's quit holding everyone else up because of the troublemakers and the chronic loafers in our school system....and there are plenty of those kids in the system now and more are on the way!!!!

optimism-On the students at charter that is NOT true.Awhile back there was a news report that had said charter students work harder to get the credits needed to graduate.There are many different reasons students go to charter,in that story I can't remember how many were homeless.(it was a high number)I don't know anyone that has gone to charter ,but I'm thankful that we have it available for the students.

Well, it is good to know that these kids do have to go to school elsewhere...I didn't know that. But it is my understanding that kid's at charter schools get extra credits for the same work public school kid's get the regular amount for. That is not fair. Once again, rewarded. Why wouldn't they want to go to a charter? I could be understanding this wrong, but that is the way it is in our school district.

An expelled student is still required by law to go to school. He just has to go somewhere else.

Looks like the public wants pictures, addresses and the whole story.

I mean, if it's good enough for the kids stealing beer and lap-dancing single moms... it's good enough here!

Well, at the risk of sounding pesimistic....here is yet another group of expelees who will have more time on there hands to run the streets and create caois among the civillians as well as students. These kids should be required to be institutionalized in a military school, then they would think twice about being unruly. Basically they are being rewarded with not having to go to school because they obviously don't use school as a means of education anyway. Let's make a consequence for violence!!!

Its my guess its the students involved with the knife at Parker High School.

Amazing! The school district is REQUIRED to release the names and personal data of any and ALL high school students to the military under Bush's No Child Left Behind program - if those students haven't "opted out" each year - or the school will lose its federal funding. Yet they cannot publicly release the names of those students who use violence to resolve their conflicts and endanger other students. As with everything else, money gains access.

or it is the individual school district's policy of what can/cannot be disclosed (based on the district's interpretation of FERPA privacy laws). One incident was involving the Janesville School District and the other incident was in the Edgerton School District.

Judging from this article, the Gazette is free to report more details if they come from others.
http://gazettextra.com/weblogs/latest-ne...

As a parent of a high school child, I would certainly like to talk to my child about it.

It's hard to believe there is a federal privacy law that would block releasing the name of the High School. Perhaps an overly narrow interpretation of the rule?