Maybe the "popular discussions" list is updated continuously by looking at how many people posted on a given topic within the last 24 hours. During the last day or so, this topic has been rather quiet.

I read in the news today that Sarah Palin didn't know that Africa was a continent. She thought it was all one big country. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/wo...

Why isn't the "popular discussions" list updating anymore?

"Adults are compassionate and encourage mercy; children are innocent and demand justice."

No olive branch has been extended. This is your typical political garbage. This country is more divided then ever. The hope and change that all these goofs voted for will be in the form of double digit unemployment, sky rocketing inflation, and a country that will be on the brink of depression in a few short years.
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On a positive note this will be easy pickens if you play the markets. Short selling has all ready made many huge gains the past year, and it will make you even bigger gains the coming years. Even Obama's capital gains/income tax increases will be no big deal with the obscene profits you will reap from the economic collapse via short selling.

Slantie what has Obama run before?

I was behind this lady today and she had the Obama sticker on the back of her Van the big O one with the red white and blue symbol on it and two other small stickers. I really couldn't see them to good so I got a little closer and the sticker said warning: buying foreign products cost American jobs. The van she was driving was a Toyota. HA HA can you say confused?

The American people have spoken loudly and made a historic choice. I hope all you bloggers who are always going on and on about 'patriotism' and how us on the left are suppossedly 'unpatriotic' by expressing our first amendment rights, will do your patriotic duty and get behind President Elect Obama, who is generously offering out an olive branch. It's time to stop questioning one another and get to work solving problems. Obviously, Obama ran one heck of a campaign- I think that speaks volumes about how he can and will run this country and return greatness to the everyday in American.

I will be the first to tell people I was not a huge Obama supporter, nor a big McCain person either. I voted for McCain because I questioned Obama's character. Now that Mr. Obama has been elected as our next president, I have no problem rallying around this man and giving him the benefit of the doubt. If people truly listened to what he was saying, it's in everyone's best interest to do the same! I've been saying all along, this country's biggest glaring weakness is we are not unified! I'm praying this will be the change we all need to make that happen. People will badmouth and people will mock him, but, it's not going to help our mission if we choose to be bitter about things! I will support our new president and represent this country with the dignity and set of values Mr. Obama spoke of in his victory speach. It's within all of us to bring positive change to this country. President Obama can't do it himself. I'm "All In".....................

The American people have spoken. We have to stand with him. I just hope he won't go as far left as his record has indicated.

"Obama trounces McCain in students' mock election"
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There's nothing "mock" about it anymore.

No surprise tonight.

lakekennedy, anyway you slice it, what whybesad said is the truth. Your walking talking mouthpiece for mediocrity just won the state of Wisconsin's electoral vote. I've said all along, be careful what you wish for people...........

SHOULD GRADE SCHOOLS TEACH ANY OF THIS? .NO THEY SHOULDNT.BREAKS CHILDRENS HEART,EVERYBODY KNOWS THE ELECTION IS RIGGED.McCAIN WILL WIN .

Birds of a feather vote together
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/...

whythink- So if the commission said that she violated ethics law and did something illegal you wouldn't be jumping up and down and saying you knew she was bad. You lefties always have excuses. She did nothing wrong accept it.

Again, he did not specify in his remarks what type of soldier. He simply said, the soldiers coming back should be able to become teachers without filling out all the paperwork that some states require. He did not qualify his remarks with, military educators or military grunts. He said it in a debate and he should have put a little more detail in that statement. To most people without a military background that statement sounded like any soldier could come home and perfrom that job. I am aware there are different levels of skill in the armed forces but none of that was qualified.
As for that statement being unpatriotic??? How so? As far as me finding you facts comparing a liberal arts degree from the UW to government training, I can't because there probably isn't a comparison. I guess that part would simply be my opinion, which could be neither right or wrong.

I am grateful to ALL of the military for doing what they do. I could care less if they are a Colonel or someone on the front lines. To me they are all equal in what they provide for our country. For you to say that some soldiers are better than others is unpatriotic as they are all in the military for one reason, TO GIVE US FREEDOM. They grant us the ability to argue about stupid things on internet blogs. I'm done with this argument.

I am voting McCain but I simply did not like that statement without any detail. It isn't anything more than that.

I'm not sitting back MOCO428, I'm right here waiting for the facts you have first hand about a liberal degree in teaching vs us government training in education,not your opinion. I asked you a question, can YOU answer it? Or do you want to talk about what you hear on tv? Do you think McCain went though all the details in his remark? Your emotionally and judgmentally thinking anyone who is a soldier can transition to teach as your posts dictate are clearly wrong.
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Let me remind you, your the one who lumped all soldiers into one group either rescind your remarks or stand up and take it like a man.

Whats bad for America is good for Democrats.

This conversation below me is a big reason why I'm glad I moved away from Janesville to Madison. You people are spending time arguing over an article about ELEMENTARY school-aged children doing a MOCK election. Ridiculous. The election is today, and may the best man win. Move on.

I'll try to clear this up for all you "insert expletive here_________'s" out there. McCain's words were that he would push for soldiers coming back to be able to go into teaching without all the paperwork some states require. That was it, there was no more explanation than that. I understood this to be any soldier, not ones that already heald a teaching position because they already would get their job back per government law. As far as government training, I think it works for some jobs but not all, teaching is one of them.

*

Rep_of_1: Do not sit back and call me unpatriotic because of my opinion. I am basing my argument soley on what was said in the debate and nothing more. If there were more information about this my opinion could change but there isn't.

What fallacies are you talking about? McCain made the statement it was on television. There are no fallacies in my statement. He did not say anything about soldiers that were already teachers so quit with that stupid argument!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gov. Sarah Palin violated no ethics laws when she fired her public safety commissioner, the state personnel board concluded in a report released Monday. "There is no probable cause to believe that the governor, or any other state official, violated the Alaska Executive Ethics Act in connection with these matters," the report says.

Come on Whybesad...
So the bipartisan group said she violeted ethics and the person APPOINTED BY THE HER said she didn't.

SHOCKING!

Keep on dreaming Lisa. Ribbit, Ribbit.

No Darius, you admire whybesad because you FEEL that he's saying what needs to be heard.

Amen, Darius. And it doesn't matter which party is elected they are both bought and paid for.

frmrjnvl,
You could look at it as fear mongering tactics. Infact, the majority of the citizens in this country have been lulled to sleep by the media. It's better to be aware of what's going around you than to be oblivious to what's actually happening in the world today. Unfortunatley, that's the mainstream mindset today. People for the mostpart, are not in touch with reality. It's like the frog in boiling water analogy: if you boil a pot of water and throw a frog in it, he'll jump out. If you put a frog in cold water and turn the temperature up a couple of degrees at a time, he'll stay there until you boil him to death. That's what's happening with the people in this country. They've accepted what's been handed to them and it's dead wrong! Gas prices for instance! My son was born in '97 and the price of gas was $1.15/gallon ...in 11 years it made it up to $4/gallon. Has the cost of living skyrocketed?? You bet it has, yet has the working man's wages been enhanced accordingly to keep up with the soaring cost of everything? NO! It's because people have been lulled to sleep with the corporate driven media that teaches people how to accept complacency and how to be happy where you're at living in the country that they're in! THE AMERICAN DREAM!...WRONG! This country was not founded that way nor is that the idea our forefathers had in mind! Our govt. is running this country and our govt. is run by "Corporate America". Control the media, control the masses! This isn't a scare tactic by any means, by me! It's called wake up and smell the coffee! A country that's not united and willing to accept mediocrity and allow the govt. to give handouts to keep us happy is a walking time bomb! All people need to do is read their history and they'll see what I'm saying is true. Instead, they base their future on the media they're receiving today! That's a huge mistake and it's happening right under our noses. People in this country are majorly disconnected from reality and truth and it's going to catch up with us unless more people wake up and buy into the fact that what I'm saying is actually happening. Those who wish to stick their head in the sand and take what they get have no reason to complain if they aren't willing to face reality and do something to be proactive rather than reactive! It's not rocket science! "WHYBESAD" is not a fear monger, I admire him because he's got the courage and the guts to tell people what they need to hear!

whybesad-I've seen it so often-Barack Obama came straight to a presidential bid after only serving 143 days as senator? Do you mean less than 5 months? And before that?
I think it's a very misleading statement, not to mention completely false. Too many people pass on some bits of things they hear like the coal story, the Ayers story....without bothering to make sure. Why? Because they sound good (or should I say bad?)
Take a look here if you truly want to pass on some facts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obam...

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article...

whybesad? I guess you haven't noticed that the world has gotten a lot smaller. It very much matters what other countries think of our president. Should Americans vote solely on that? No, should Americans be reactionary, protectionist , and spiteful of what those who were by chance born within other sets of borders think? No. I'm so tired of this "the other side is scary" argument. I saw a sign at a McCain rally yesterday that said "If Obama wins, God help us all." Some people seem to think we are electing a dictator, or worse the anti-Christ. We aren't, we are electing someone to what is probably the most closely watched job in the world, so what makes you think anyone in that position can on day 1 destroy the country? Being rational about it shows what tactics like whybesad's are - fear mongering.

Gov. Sarah Palin violated no ethics laws when she fired her public safety commissioner, the state personnel board concluded in a report released Monday. "There is no probable cause to believe that the governor, or any other state official, violated the Alaska Executive Ethics Act in connection with these matters," the report says.

Tom- What has Obama done to "deserve to win"? What international "experience" has he had? Should we really care what other countries think and who they would want as OUR President? If you think we should than that is a scary thing. We need to worry about what and who is best to lead this Country in a time of war. Obama has 143 days served in the US Senate is that enough experience?

What if that soldier was a National Guard member who was a teacher before the did their tour? You would deny them their job back? Come on that's just foolish and against the law.

Sent from MOC0428
"Can you read??? I am stronly against troops coming home and being able to become teachers. There are hoops there for a reason and they must be negotiated! How you read otherwise I don't understand. Do not berate my comments without fully reading my posts! My wife is a teacher and not any old soldier coming come could do her job, or any teachers job for that matter."

I can fully read and comprehend English with out the fallacies that you try to write in private or posted to persuade your point. An "any old American solider" is a trained individual, perhaps even trained in education before enlistment and during service and after honorable discharge. What makes the U.S. government training less viable than your perception of what a teaching degree should entail from a university? You "think"(I use this term loosely) I berate your post. I honorably, sincerely think your perception of a U.S. Solders especially to generalize them all into one category is first and foremost unpatriotic and derogatory.

"Many believe Obama's international experience would go a long way in helping repair damage caused by the unpopular U.S.-led war in Iraq, with recent opinion polls from more than 70 nations favoring him a resounding three-to-one over Republican John McCain.

Newspapers across the globe came out in support of the Democratic candidate Monday.

"Obama the best hope for U.S. revival," said an editorial in The Australian Financial Review. The Gulf News, an English-language paper in the United Arab Emirates, agreed, saying only he could "undo the great damage done by the Bush administration to America's image," especially in the Middle East. Obama "deserves to win," declared The Irish Times."

Whatdidyousay Nov 3, 2008 at 2:02 p.m.
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Is someone looking for proof of pushing agenda’s (at least in California) in public schools:
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SCHOOL CLAMS UP ON 'GAY' PLEDGE CARDS GIVEN TO KINDERGARTNERS
A California school system refuses to say what action, if any, it will take after it received complaints about a kindergarten teacher who encouraged her students to sign "pledge cards" in support of gays
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,4458...
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First Graders Taken to San Francisco City Hall for Gay Wedding
In the same week that the No on 8 campaign launched an ad that labeled as "lies" claims that same-sex marriage would be taught in schools to young children, a first grade class took a school-sponsored trip to a gay wedding. Eighteen first graders traveled to San Francisco City Hall Friday for the wedding of their teacher and her lesbian partner, The San Francisco Chronicle reported. The school sponsored the trip for the students, ages 5 and 6, taking them away from their studies for the same-sex wedding.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20081011/pl...
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No, no agendas being pushed here!!

Now Obama wants to bankrupt coal mines. Is this the "change" you want? Thousands of people work in coal mines and make "living" wages. Now, he wants to put those people out of business? WOW!!! No wonder he wanted his cronies to vote early. The more and more we learn the scarier he becomes.

I'm sure many of the parents that read these posts that choose to back Obama would have an issue with their pastors teaching hate towards America to their children like Rev. Wright did for years to Obama. How can people just dismiss that fact that's been put in plain sight for everyone to see? Just because Obama decided to cut ties with him because it makes him look bad, doesn't change what's in his heart! As someone said, are the people in this country willing to play "Russian Roulette" with this guy and the future of the U.S.?

lakekennedy...I'm not speaking of you specifically, but, what you just said applies both ways. I've seen many Obama supporters resort to the same tactics.

whatdidyousay: You're like many of the Republican's I've spoken with. When pressed for proof, you resort to insults.

whybesad: Can you slam our educators any more?

Just because they belong to a union that endorses democrats does not mean they all will vote that way. There are many teachers that do not agree with the union they are in or that WEAC urges them to vote democratic. They will vote on what they know just like the rest of us would, not because WEAC called them up and told them to vote democratic. Give them credit they can and do think on their own.

rep_of_1:

Reread my post. I stronly disagree with this view. Under no uncertain terms should a soldier be able to come home and begin teaching as he suggested. Quit skimming what people write and read all the text.

Whythink:
All depends on how you phrase the policies, which of course reveals your bias. An Obama supporter will present "just the facts" in a much different way than a McCain supporter - so your point about letting the kids make up their own minds becomes very difficult to accept at face value.

Pro-Choice vs. Pro-life is perhaps the best example.

When it comes down to, it is impossible for any of us to remove the bias with which we see things. But being more conservative myself, and having worked in many local school districts (Beloit, Janesville, Clinton) it is my opinion that most teachers I've seen in action do an admirable job of trying to maintain some balance in the way they present things. I'm not afraid of my own kids hearing things from a different perspective as long as they are reminded that it is a "perspective" and then we can sit down and talk about where I/we might disagree. I've done this with my oldest (only 10 yrs. old) and it can lead to some great discussions.

Whatdidyousay

Have you ever considered that students can be given both sides of the issue and simply side with the Dems.?

Young people, especially before they start paying taxes and supporting a family are often very idealistic and fair. Most children I know would support taking some of raising Trump's taxes while lowering their parents. They perhaps don't and can't understand all the details that would lead someone to believe that is wrong.

Most students will like the idea of Health Care for all and ending the war in Iraq. If you present the ideas of both candidates as I did and ask the student who they side with, the dems win. Not because of the evil teachers union but because young people prefer those ideas...
treatment vs. prison for non-violent drug offenders
pro-choice
ending the War in Iraq
Lowering Tuition costs-college more affordable
Tax Cuts for middle class - ending GW's cuts for the rich (McCain called them that)

The one thing my students didn't like was the gun control part but most still said they prefer Obama.

Look, GW has a horrible approval rating and other than the teacher, most students get their political opinion from the Daily Show, SNL, Late Night (Letterman or Leno), Bob and Tom type Radio.

I appreciate the community of the Gazette once again looking to support the teachers by blaming them for students support of the democrats.

Look, I know I have biases so I am very careful of how I facilitate political talks in my classroom. I struggle with representing McCain's plan for Health Care as a tax credit while taxing my benefits and leaving many Americans who work without benefits as equal to Obama's plan to basically get everyone the same benefits he has. I don't think I can present them as equal but I try. I present the info. and the students make their conclusions. They research and figure things out for themselves. Heck, most still think I favor McCain.
I am guessing most teachers do a good job but in the end their bias may come out. With older kids it is easy, make it research but with the younger kids, it is more difficult.

Once again gazette community, THANKS FOR THE SUPPORT!

whatdidyousay: ALL I asked you for was some specific evidence to support it. YOU have none. YOU have your opinions. GREAT. Not worth more than anyone elses.
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I obviously need to clear something up here. I don't think, and have never posted that someone needs to go to college to be intelligent. I WILL say that there are PLENTY of intelligent people there, particularly the professors. Now, the fact that the right can't even try and consider someone elses viewpoint, more specifically consider the fact that the majority of academia is liberal. I find that frustrating. I listen a lot closer to a Veteran on issues surrounding military action than I do a non veteran.

Money is small measure when measuring a persons overall success. A person that gives more than they have taken would be a great role in American education. This mind set doesn't happen in the institution we mislabel as college.
But yet listed are the top earners that are looked up to? Where is mindset of this country heading to? Higher education is only taught in one way of thinking.

Abe Lincoln was self taught never had a college education. Albert Einstein dropped out of prep school at age 15. Thomas Edison went to work for the railroad at age 12. I would support my child in whatever decision they choose to make. I would hope they would continue their education but, if they end up deciding that school isn't for them than all I can do is support them in their decisions. Hopefully, they make a decisions that better's themselves.

lakennedy Nov 2, 2008 at 5:58 p.m.
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Heres a few names you might recognize that never completed college:
- Bill Gates
- Paul Allen
- Sam Walton
- Michael Dell
- Steve Jobs
- Larry Ellison
- Jerry Yang
- Kirk Kerkorian
- Sir Richard Branson
- Ralph Lauren
- Steve Case
- John R. Simplot
- Alan Gerry

Einstein never finished high school(he withdrew) and flunked his first college entrance exam.
Perfect example of books smarts only get you so far. If you don't have a well rounded education you didn't get to move on to college when education has unbiased.
A well rounded education is worth gold. America had scientists that were the very best in our own country prior to invade of liberal thinking. Too bad an education now tips so far to the liberal side that children are missing the biggest picture of all. There are some professors that have far more to offer that aren't allowed in the Liberal Kool Aid club.

Congratulations to Ken Hendricks. Not everyone needs school to be successful, and I never stated that they did. By the way, would you endorse your childrens decision to drop out of high school?
I thought not.

I agree, and I've had plenty of life experiences. Intelligence can be a dangerous thing. But while you equate it with people like Bundy, Hitler, etc. The fact that you refuse to acknowledge people like Einstein, Jefferson, etc, speaks volumes about the level of yours.

Ken Hendricks dropped out of highschool. FYI

Brilliant minds? Come on. Hitler was considered a brilliant mind. So was Ted Bundy. That doesn't stick lakekenndy. It's one thing to be book smart and then there is common sense. Life experiences have a lot more impact on a person's life than any book can teach you. Is your kool-aid glass empty yet?

Regarding your university comment, I mean it couldn't be that the reason the majority of professors lean to the left is because they are some of the most brilliant minds the U.S. has to offer? I mean, you act like being a liberal is a bad thing. Do you have the ability to teach at a school like Madison? Do you think that maybe, somehow, these people know things you just don't? How about a little respect. I'm not saying get in line and follow anybody, but there definitely is something to be said to the fact that the majority of academia is liberal.
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I guess they all drink the kool-aid, too, huh? You must be smarter than they.

So, let me get this straight, the unions are indoctrinating our children?
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Does WEAC set the curriculum for our children? Nope.
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Can you give me an actual fact that links anything you just wrote to specific evidence that actually PROVES a case of indocrination? Teachers names? Specific quotes? (I defined what this evidence was in the post you tried to respond to) just wondering. You see, you seem to be so sure of this, but unable to prove it. Hmmm.
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I've taken many political science courses, and it is true that children this age tend to follow what their parents believe in regarding politics. A lot of times they aren't spoken to directly, but overhearing things, etc.

Aren't most teachers union members? Doesn't WEAC give all kinds of money to the Democratic party? The teachers do have a biased that is evident in public schools and in the universities.

What is socialist about offering the students an opportunity to participate in a mock election? That is pretty damn ridiculous, whatdidyousay. I mean unless you are in the schools and can offer specific instances and examples where children are indoctrinated, and offer specific names of teachers, and can give specific quotes from these teachers, then your opinion is just that, an opinion. And in case you're wondering, although you are a vet and I have nothing for the upmost respect for your service to our country, your opinion (on this issue in particular) doesn't hold any more weight than any one elses.
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It's easy to spew nonsense, and almost appealing if you are unhappy with a particular result, but until you give me the evidence I seek, I have to say that you're full of it on this one.

to thekai--"prefer that we have a formal education beyond just military training, and that's part of why we also have the Montgomery GI Bill." this would also be the same GI bill that john mccain voted against.

No.
The one thing this article shows us is that our school system took the opportunity to engage our children in the election process. Voting is the most BASIC of our civic duties. I applaud them for that.

I think the one thing we can surely take from the article is that our government schools are doing a great job of indoctrinating our children in liberal thinking. Too bad that doesn't seem to leave enough time for teaching what USED to be the basics!

Eksreigh Oct 31, 2008 at 2:03 p.m.
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So, the choices are:
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Take the express train to the ravine where the bridge is out (Obama).
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Or, take the slow train to the ravine where the bridge is out (McCain).
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Maybe select a third party candidate that actually understands the Constitution and abides by it, while trying to apply the brakes, as the coalman keeps throwing coal into the engine!
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Or, sit in the back car, with a parachute under your jacket, so you can land safely, and enjoy the ride!

razorsharp, I agree with you that many (most?) of the voters have simple minds and are easily swayed. But what "lack of character" does Obama have that McCain doesn't also share? For every Ayers or Rezko that Obama knows, McCain knows a Liddy or a Keating. Being a senator for more years, McCain has had the opportunity to vote for or against more bills, but what has he accomplished that's "worth talking about"? There may be something, I don't know, but what is it?
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I know that both men attended good schools after graduating from high school. Obama went to Columbia and Harvard Law School, where he graduated magna cum laude (with great honor), while McCain went to the U.S. Naval Academy and graduated 894 out of 899.

You're correct about Obama not being a state senator in 2005. He resigned in November, 2004, after being elected to the U.S. Senate.
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Year 2005 statistics are the latest I could find on the government web site. But why would you need something more recent? If Obama's last state senate term ended in 2004, wouldn't statistics from that period and slightly afterward be most relevant?
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To the best of my knowledge, Obama hasn't been bragging that he reduced the poverty rate in Cook County. Cook's poverty rate ranks solidly in the middle third of all U.S. counties, so its rating really can't be used as an argument either way.
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You're correct in that Cook County has a high crime rate. Using 1996 statistics, the most recent I could easily find, the county ranked as the 13th worst in the country. Maricopa County, which includes Phoenix, ranked 28th worst during the same period. Admittedly, those numbers don't coincide with Obama's time in the senate. But even if the numbers didn't change by 2006, it's unreasonable to expect a new state senator to clean up the crime problem in the country's third most populous county, all in five years. It doesn't reflect on his willingness or ability to bring changes as president. Also, remember that although the president can recommend new laws, he doesn't make them (excluding executive orders, etc.). Laws are made by the Congress.
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This whole issue of whether or not Cook County's crime and poverty rates changed while Obama was a state senator is somewhat of a red herring. State senators don't have the power to make those kind of social changes. Major decisions affecting poverty and crime would have to be enacted by the governor.
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Believe it or not, I don't support Obama. I'm just pointing out inconsistencies in your arguments.

FYI Obama wasn't in the State senate in 2005.

2005 statistics. it's 2008 almost 2009. Find something a little more updated. State Senators are in charge of the state issues more than US senators. So, Obama did have a chance to correct the issues in his district. What's cook county's crime rate? It's among the highest in the country. And a poverty rate in the top 50% isn't something to hang your hat on especially while your running on the promises of "change".

whybesad, I can find nothing that would indicate Obama ever held political office in the Chicago government. He was elected three times as an Illinois state senator, and for five years he represented South Side Chicago neighborhoods at the state legislature. A junior state senator really isn't in a position to significantly reduce corruption or poverty in a major city or its surrounding county, especially in only three non-consecutive terms.
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Can you point to any examples of McCain reducing corruption or poverty in Arizona?
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Cook County doesn't seem to have one of the highest poverty rates in the country, unless by "one of the highest" you mean in the top 50%. There are approximately 3,193 counties in the U.S., and approximately 1,400 of them have higher poverty rates than the 15.0% designated for Cook County. Notably, Illinois' overall rate is 12.0%, while Arizona's overall rate is 14.4%.
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2005 statistics at http://www.ers.usda.gov/Data/Povertyrate...

whybesad... you have a good point. You have given me a good reason not to vote for McCain. He has done nothing but drive the middle class, working stiff, into ruin..He is a Bush clone, no doubt about it... 26 yrs in the senate, & all he accomplished was get involved with Keating, & all the other bums. If I vote for Obama, I MAY get screwed. If I vote for McCain, I will definetly get screwed. Some choice, huh !!

Localboy is one of those people that writes an ignorant statement, is called on it, tries to backtrack from it, is called on that, and then just decides to show his true colors after all.
A guy with a 129 IQ would be too smart to see how transparent that is. I don't believe you. I'm calling MENSA to make sure they look closely at any new applications.

razorsharp Obama came up through the very corrupt Chicago political climate. He didn't "change" that while he was there. Cook county has one of the highest poverty rates in the United States he didn't "change" that while he was there. Fact is he really hasn't done much to "change" anything where he has been. I can tell you until I'm blue in the face that I'm going to "change" something. But, I like to look at results that show what you have done before. That is a good indicator of what you will do in the future Obama has none of that.

tjncj- my IQ test was submitted by a liberal, ineffective, over paid, union card carrying public school teacher. Does that make you feel better?

Localboy, what the hell does that last statement mean? If the shoe fits? I agree if you are admitting you are a hypocritical jerk. Where did you get your IQ test, a bubble gum machine?

One sentence is this article bothered me: "The kids accurately predicted the real vote in 1988, 1992 and 1996."
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I'm worried that too many adults try to do the same thing; that is, vote for the person they think will win the election so they can pat themselves on the back Wednesday morning. According to the media, you've got a decent shot at picking the winner if you vote for McCain or Obama. So is it a waste of your vote if you vote for a third party candidate? Or is it a waste of your vote if you vote against your conscience and instead select somebody the media says might win?

I'm so proud of these kids... They don't seem to buy the McCain bull crap either. Yay!

It is with some trepidation that I would opine on the opinion of the opinionated, but in the course of discourse... "quite frankly I don't care what you think." either.
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Gooday

JohnDoe - I am not sure the intent of your post, but I think you are implying that you sometimes agree with me, and sometimes do not. My opinion is strictly based on the context of the subject, whether it has value, or just forraje discussions. My ability to opine will vary, as subject and subjects dictate my response. I have a soft spot for patriots, military individuals, anybody who is accountable, and a contributor. This might be construed as me being a popinjay, but I don't really care.

thekai you are right. But, I think you misinterpreted my point -- troops to teachers or accountants or mechanics, or whatever) without training is absurd. If you have the training that carries over and transfers to credits towards a degree then great. BUT, if not then that is what is absurd if they are trying to get whatever type of job.
Please don't patronize me about the military. Yes, I do know of the extensive training programs the military has to offer. My best friend going back nearly twenty years is in the Army. I have had several family in the military. Do I sense some hostility in your made up comments about me calling soldiers barbarians and only knowing how to shoot a gun? Sorry, you're not getting that tone from me I seriously looked into going into the military but decided against it and went to college instead.
Next truckdrivers, my father is a truck-driver and once again I was emphasizing how you also need the correct education to do that job.

Bottom line: With proper education a soldier should have the right to qualify for any job. Without the proper education, too bad but I'm still proud of them.

With your qualifications you should think about being a Tech Ed teacher. They are always in high demand especially with automotive skills/interest

localboy...re-read your own posts...and then consider this...it is but a circle from genius to imbecile...and see how far you are betwixt the two.

thekai - don't forget that you are also reliable, punctual, respectful, and team orientated. Most employers jump at the chance to hire ex-military personnel because of the upside of their qualities.

MrPerfect,
Please reconsider what you have said. First of all, there is a program for those of us in the military called, "Proud to Serve Again." It's for service members who are interested in going into teaching once they leave the military. I myself have considered this option because I love kids and I think I would really enjoy being a teacher. The program is designed to ensure that service members who become teachers are very well trained, and even so that they may shine above the average teacher. We do many things in the military besides just point a gun and pull a trigger...
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I'm a generator mechanic. My primary job is to fix diesel engines and generators. I can also do interior wiring. I'm trained to read schematics and even to work on circuit boards and solid state devices. I have also been trained in hazardous waste management, and administrative work. As a non-commissioned officer in the Marine Corps, I am expected to provide monthly evaluations and counselings of the Marines under me, so I have to be able to adapt to many different leadership styles. The Marine Corps teaches us to use 14 leadership traits, and these fundamentals that the Marine Corps is built upon can all transfer into the civilian world. It would not be crazy for me, a Marine, to get out and get a job as a diesel engine mechanic. The Marine Corps, Army, Air Force, and Navy all have their own accountants too, so yes, some veterans would be very well suited to be an accountant, since they've already received the training and have had a lot of on the job training.
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Lastly, there is a very prestigious program for service members called Troops to Truckers. This program is designed to provide specialized training for service members so that they can be highly skilled truck drivers. You would be surprised at how many actually do take advantage of this program, and get out of the service with a very well paying job. It is funny that you even mentioned imagining service members getting out and being truck drivers.
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The United State's Military is not a group of barbarians. We are highly skilled and well trained in many jobs, 95% of which directly relate to the civilian world. Most employers still prefer that we have a formal education beyond just military training, and that's part of why we also have the Montgomery GI Bill.

of course Obama will "trounce" McCain in a kids election! That's why he'll win the real election among the adults too because the majority of the adults today have the same level of thought activity as these kids.... many simple minds!

I'm sure MENSA isn't missing you.

Soldiers coming home and going straight to teaching is scary. Sure some could and would do a great job. BUT, let's throw in another profession and see how just as absurd it seems... Here we go: Soldiers coming home and going straight into accounting. OR Soldiers coming home and going straight into truck-driving. OR well hopefully you get the point. They deserve some points for their experiences but they still need the proper training. I sure hope I am hearing Mccain wrong and whoever else is saying to make soldiers teachers when they come back. Let's turn this around... I am a hunter and know how to shoot a gun so can I go right over to Irag? Nope, the army would stil need to train me.

tjncj - if the truth stings, so be it.

Curlrock - I have an IQ of 129. I just missed MENSA, and quite frankly I don't care what you think.

Hey, MOCO...I did not call you a neo-con unless you group yourself with the extreme right-wing of the Republican party. Those are, and I think this is pretty clear, the folks I was speaking about. So if you feel the sting, it must be because you consider yourself a neo-con, not because I do. I don't know you as an individual, and was casting no aspersions against you. It almost sounds like you feel a little guilty about your political leanings. Why else would you assume I was directing anything at you? Why so defensive?

MOC0428 You comment on soldiers coming home not having to have a degree to teach is way off base. If you are in college and deploy when you come back you have to jump though a lot of hoops to get back into finish a teaching degree. Mr. McCain would like the soldiers coming home to be able to continue their degree with all the hoops or having to start over. Do you really believe soliders can teach with no education? GET REAL.

totellthetruth: I am typically a republican, usually more towards center. For you to accuse teachers or being biased towards one side or the other is wrong. If they lean democratic, there are probably some valid reasons.

Did you listen to the last McCain/Obama debate?
McCain said he would like to see our veterans coming home and be able to get a teaching job without all the paperwork some states require.

What????????????????? That comment could turn even some republicans. Our educators go to school and earn degrees so that they can educate our children to the best of their abilities. During the 4 years that they are at college that are taught how to teach. Why or how on earth does a veteran coming back from war deserve that privelege? Do not get me wrong, the veterans deserve much more than they get right now. I am very appreciative that they give the rest of us freedoms. That, however does not earn them the right to teach our youth over someone with a degree!

markr: First of all I'm not a neo-con. There are a few things from each party that I strongly disagree with. I don't think either of the candidates is right for the job but we don't have much of a choice do we? I do have an issue with spreading the wealth, taxing home sales etc..... If my family does well and makes a good living why should I share with the ones that do not? I already give to many charities, most of my cloths and whatnot go to goodwill. I donate to the United Way, why do they think they have the right to take more away from me. If you are poor there are things you can do to get out of your current situation. If you don't want to try to better your career then don't whine about it and certainly don't take any more of my money. I understand some people fall into these circumstance because of illness or other tragic means, that is why I give to charity. These people typically aren't the burden on society as they still try to be productive. Some may call that selfish, if it is, then so be it. I give to other people who are not fortunate and the government should not take more from me to do more of the same.

As for sarcasm, I fully appreciate it, I just didn't catch it. It is difficult to catch sarcasm in print. Don't go off calling everyone that disagrees with your opinions a neo-con.

Most teachers support the democratic party but that does not mean MOST TEACHERS are biased in their instruction regarding this or any other election.

I would guess many teachers are socially conservative but support the democratic party because of what the republican party believes about public education. What profession would support a party that consistantly disrespects their profession?

whythink - true not all teachers are biased, just most of them, and the ones who continue to push the Democratic party. Isn't that the party that the WEA pushes to. NO COINCIDENCE I think!

staticrush

Not all teachers are going to be unbiased. Don't judge all of us by one worksheet from one teacher.

Oh this is choice. For those of you who think public school curriculum is not intended to sway our childrens mind, let me describe my child's work sheet on elections. It is from "The Mailbox Teachers Helper TEC48039 Oct/Nov 2008" It has the picture of one candidate, a drawing of an african american man with an amazing likeness to Obama that says "Vote for me." ....Coincidence?

Localboy tells John doe to "Attack the point not the person" and then attacks a person who has given their life to teaching the disabled.

What a hypocritical jerk.

Localboy- That response only reinforces the blogs estimation of your intelligence

. You can be a Nobel Laureate and not qualify to teach in most public schools today. They don’t have all the proper credits in educational “theory” or “methodology” — all they have is learning and the desire and ability to share it. If we’re putting the interests of students first, then those qualifications should be enough.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

MCCAIN: Well, it's the civil rights issue of the 21st century. There's no doubt that we have achieved equal access to schools in America after a long and difficult and terrible struggle.

In NY, a starting teachers pay can be double in difference based on the distrct. Upper Middle Class district = double the starting pay of a poor inner city district. HOW IS THAT EQUAL?
From: The Shame of the Nation by Jonathan Kozol

http://www.debates.org/pages/trans2008d....

Imagine that, the schools overwhelmingly voted for Obama. And people say the teachers don't influence the kids at all. I am guessing if you polled the teachers, the results would be about the same-can't say I have run into many that would vote Republican.

That is because John McCain doesn't respect the pforession of educator. He actually said that education theory and methodology is not necessary. He also believes that we have achieved equal education for all students.

John McCain doesn't get it...that is why teachers don't support him.

I don't believe teachers, especially at the elementary school level are biased when discussing the election. When you talk about the 2 candidates and yes look at the two candidates most YOUNG children are going to agree with Obama and like his appearance (YOUNG) more. Young children are going to support ideas like Health Care for ALL American, tax cuts for the middle class instead of the rich, ending the war sooner rather than later in Iraq, etc...

When I went through the issues with my high school students they agreed more with Obama. I had them research different issues using the candidates own websites and they chose Obama. I refuse to say who I supported but most of my students thought it was McCain.

totellthetruth..........Smoking pot is NOT bad?? You must be the first doper Republican I have ever met? You better have a bunch rolled for November 4 to get through this one pal.

After listening to my kids tell me how much time the kids have had to listen to this politial cr.... My son had a representitive from the Democratic party speak to his class last week. I wonder where that came from. If you only present one side of an argument you will only get one result. If you tell the kids all about how Obama will help America, that's what the kids will learn. It's like telling the kids smoking pot is bad and that 1+1=3. IF you tell them enough it is hard to distinguish the whole truths from the 1/2 truths.. It looks the WEA has a victory here.

Curlrock - that is because your girlfriend is not smart enough to get her work done in 40 hours.

I choose to send my kids to a parochial school because I want them to get a Christian education.

Let's see we have been called closed-mind, simple, paranoid, superstitious, snooty and now a racist. I can't wait to see what comes up next.

The main reason that parents choose private grade school is not Christianity. It is to shield their kids from non-white kids. Of course they would not vote for Obama.

It cracks me up when people try to tag Obama as a socialist. What's more socialistic than the current situation, with the government starting to own banks??

I went to St Paul's from Pre-K 3 through 8th grade. My brother, sister, and cousin go there now.
And all I can say is: GO OBAMA!!!
My props to the few parochial schools who chose Obama over McCain. Perhaps I should convince my mom to transfer my siblings to one of those schools! haha :P

lakennedy, you're right. But, people shouldn't base their vote on just one or two issues. Nobody agrees with everybody on everything. You have to look at the big picture.

I understand where you're coming from, redhawk. I think that a lot of Republican voters are basing their vote on their faith. A lot of the hard core right wingers are voting for the candidate that is pro-life and/or against stem cell research. I think everyone has an issue that they deem most important. To many that issue is abortion. To many that issue is the economy. To many it's Iraq. I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with this, just that it exists.

I just find it amazing that people who voted for Bush, not once but twice, would still back a republican candidate after what they have done to our country. And the really amazing thing is, they're probably the ones who would benefit the most with a Democratic President.

This is tragic! Now the liberals are committing voter fraud in our Schools, too! They are following with the tobacco companies' plans, hook 'em while they're young! I knew those dems were up to something, when they starting pulling record numbers of young and first time voters... but never have I imagined that it might actually threaten the dominantly Republican vote of older citizens... we've got to do something!
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I know sarcasm is very difficult to pick up on, when you can't hear a person's voice or see their actions. My blurb on the liberals committing voter fraud in our public schools -may- have been a bit of sarcasm.
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I went to public schools all my life, and I turned out just fine. I do believe that kids who go to public schools compete with kids who go to private schools just fine. In fact, I know of several students from public schools who out-performed students from private schools.
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Furthermore, it is my observation that many students who come out of private schools are very sheltered, and unprepared for the real world.
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I think that private schools almost exclusively and across the board teach to one bias, and that is all. In public schools, most teachers try to teach students to look at everything and make a sound decision based on their observations, not based on what some authority figure has told them. An appeal to an inappropriate authority is a fallacy, and it happens often times in parochial schools. That kind of teaching, in my opinion, is very dangerous.
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I think that people who say parochial schools do a better job at teaching sound very condescending. I received an outstanding education in Janesville's public schools.

Where's the results of the home-schooled kids? Would Nader be our next president??

Finally! proof -- public school kids ARE smarter than private school kids. ***Okay, I'm just joking.*** (although I had read once that when you compare "apples to apples" public school educated kids are smarter than their private school educated counterparts. I don't remember a source or where it was from though)
But Seriously though, it's not the school. It's not the teacher. It's not the parents. It's everything, everyone as well as the kids. We all strongly influence kids but they are also their own person too.
As for the article, I just knew when I read the results that this would be a hot topic.

What a shame to see that the parents back home have failed to teach their children. The difference between an American Idol contestant and a true Patriot American.

Out of the mouths of babes! Good night Johnny McSame!!

Localboy- You have no freaking clue about the work public school teachers do or you wouldn't make such an ignorant statement

I think it would suit us all to remember that the choice is yours to make. If you want to send your child to a private school, that's great. You obviously have your reasons for doing so. If you want to send your child to a public school, that's great. You obviously have your reasons for doing so. There's no right or wrong here. A private school may be a great environment for your child, but a poor environment for mine. No one needs to defend their decision to send their child to a public or private school.
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That being said, I do not believe for a second that there aren't "bad apples" in private schools. Are there as many as there are in public school? I don't think so. But, it is important to bear in mind that there are a lot more kids in public schools.
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Besides that, I'd also like to point out that private schooled children (the majority of them, anyway) just clearly illustrated that they are more likely to make huge mistakes when it comes to voting. Thank God they'll be in public school before they actually are of age to cast their ballots. Hopefully four years will be enough to correct these grave mistakes.
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Just kidding, calm down.

localboy- maybe you would like to talk to a girlfriend of mine, who is a special education teacher in Montana. You could call her on Saturday but would have to call her at school since she is working on a lot of (IEP's) Individual Educational Plans on the weekends lately.

localboy- "teachers who actually care about thier education, and respond with participation" Although you try to backtrack, your previous statement leaves little to interpret. Perhaps you would like to come over to one of my sisters homes some night for a visit. Between correcting papers, working on their lesson plans, or planning her science clubs activities, you might have a nice conversation.

And by the way, I also attended parochial school through 8th grade...so I know of what I speak as both a student and a parent.

Scorned republicans who are too old to remember their days in school - I remember. Politics wasn't discussed except in government classes.

Eight years, three wars, and a nation sunk in worse debt ever - yes, kids pay attention and they see how screwed up it is. Maybe if you looked around and opened your eyes (and minds) you could see the effect our modern government has had on this great country.

Don't discount a child's thoughts because they have a young mind...

I agree with the concept of private schools. As I said, I sent my own children.
What I don't agree with is how some people come across as being above others.
Nothing personal...just a perception...which just happens to be perpetuated by your post on another story..."The both probably were taught in a public school."
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See what I mean?

JohnDoe - attack the point - not the person. I also went to a private school until the 9th grade. We never had the same problems as public schools. This is for a variety of reasons. More importantly, I was completely surprised at what I did see once I did make it to public school. I was not prepared street wise, but by then I had such a foundation for good habits of right and wrong, and my schooling, I was able to stay on track.

We kind of got off track from the original posting subject. All I wanted to do is defend private schools and the many reasons parents send their children to these schools, because they often are aligned with the teachings of the school, and the discpline practices that public schools don't have the luxury of, due to worrying about being politically correct. Private schools can focus more on religion based education and discpline and not worry about all of the other harms that secular schools do.

localboy....I'll write this slowly so hopefully you can understand,
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You post said "private school(s)..plural....all inclusive.
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Your retort to my post was private school...singular...and limited to the one you are involved in.
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My post said..."Granted, they may not occur as often, but it is still there."
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I am not knocking private schools...in fact I've sent my own children to private christian schools. But the point is...too many people do not open their eyes to see or do not want to admit what goes on in our own backyards.
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You are fortunate in your little world, but you are apparently blind to what goes on the the real world...yes, even at private schools.
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I'm not condemning them, it's just a fact of life...and many people are just too blind to see.
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And to question why police aren't assigned to private schools if I dare state sometimes laws are broken there? Please, I certainly hope you are not one of those fanatics that would exaggerate someone's position simply because it is not what you want to hear.
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All I said was that it happens...and it does...we are all human...including our kids in private schools.

As teachers, we DO NOT discuss politics with our students. We teach a curriculum, but must remain anti-biassed. If students ask who we are voting for, I reply, "I cannot discuss that with you".
I truly believe that the reflection of the votes represents the parents. Kids will vote the way their folks will. One of my students that is diabetic said she was voting for Obama because he believes in stem cell research to cure diabetes.

By the way, if those things I listed happen in private schools, why are there not any local police assigned to those private schools? Because there isn't any need to. They don't even need security at their events.

JohnDoe - I am not out of touch. I am currently active in a local private school, and none of those things are going on, or hidden from our eyes. Like was posted earlier, some small incidents of behavior issues, but none of the issues I listed earlier. I am not sure what private school you are referring to, but not the one that I am involved with.

Greatplain, I said nothing about bombs, that was another post.

As far as my point about teachers influencing, maybe I should expand on my statement. Everyone has beleifs and as we see in these posts they don't always agree. Your beliefs influence who you are and how you act.

So, it would be foolish to think that a teachers beliefs wouldn't influence how they teach in some form. This doesn't mean they come right out and tell a child that they need to vote for X candidate.

By sending my kids to a parochial school I feel the teachers beliefs will be similar to mine, however it is still up to me as a parent to be aware of what my child is being taught. I had at least one experience when one of my children was in the public schools where they came home asking questions about something I felt was inappropriate, especially given their age. And no it wasn't part of the curriculum.

Finally GreatPlain and all who disagree with me. I respect your opinion, I just don't have to agree with it. I hope you do the same.

My child went to private school through 8th grade at St. Pauls. We never had a bomb threat, a lock down or the like. The most we had problems with was attitude once in awhile and a few kids with emotional issues and home problems. Nothing like my child has seen since going to a public high school. Most of us that actually pay money out of our pockets for our children to go to private school, do remain involved and up to speed on what they are learning. Some of the parents of public schooled children do this while an equal or greater amount of public school parents do not. So, I too have been a part of both the public and private school worlds and have seen them both up close. I prefer the private world :)

It's Howdy Doody time....

When we are young we believe in Robin Hood, When we are old, we go with the sherrif of Nottingham. With the current mess that Bush has given us, I can't wait for Robin Hood, Or the lone ranger, or wild Bill, Or Zorro, or any of my childhood heros, to come riding in, & save the day TA.DA ....

Localboy wrote..."Private schools: no drugs, no bomb threats, no weapons"

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Sadly you are out of touch.
Granted, they may not occur as often, but it is still there. Kids are kids. I've seen it first hand.
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Private schools just dont have to make it public knowledge...and they don't.

I have been in the public schools, teaching during the summer school session. I bring my teaching style and methods to the public school. Our school has, and continues to meet the national standards - does "Blue Ribbon School" sound familiar? (This is a program through US Department of Education)Yes, we teach the 3rs as will each school in this city. No, we haven't had a bomb threat lately, but we have students who are learning disabled, come from families with marital problems, and we have our share of single parent homes, low income homes, and families who are or will be unemployed. All of these issues come into play as we teach and interact with the children. I wonder if these same issues might lead a child to vote one way or another. Not the input from the teacher! This discussion is on whether a parochial teacher is pushing a political agenda, not what our curriculum differences may be.

Like these results should come as any surprise?
WI is going for Obama by about a 10% margin in most state wide tracking polls to start. Obama is out spending McCain in ads by a 5/1 margin. The teachers are heavily for obama. Hmmm, I wonder who who the majority of kids will side with?

Say what: Well said. I am willing to yield to your personal opinion. I believe you are teaching what parents want. What the fuss: I'm sorry you haven't been to a public school recently. Most days are spent on the 3rs, not worrying about bombs. They have to pass their annual yearly progress for No Child Left Behind,(unfunded federal mandate since inception). As a liberal Christian who believes in public schools, I am willing to listen to your beliefs, and hope you
will reciprocate...Brother.

localboy - really? Have you set foot in a public school lately? Or is it just easier to keep your feet firmly planted in the sides of your high horse?

Curlrock - my point was not made clear. Let us just compare schools locally.

Public Schools: Drugs, bomb threats, weapons, inappropriate dress, hungry kids, broken homes, truancy, police officers assigned in school, kids with lack of supplies. I could go on.

Private schools: no drugs, no bomb threats, no weapons, no police, no dress code issues. Accountability, respect, reverence, patriotism, atmosphere fully directed to education.

Looking at the items I have described for public schools, how can a teacher fully committ to an education with all of that outside pressure going on. I don't disagree that the teacher is committed to the education, but the system does not allow them to be.

Now that Janesville students have had the opportunity for a good start in understanding their Constitutional right to participate through the vote when they're old enough, why now bring back civics classes as REQUIRED for all students! Just as partisanship is learned, students also need to learn the entire process of being an engaged citizen in a republican democracy so they will know it's their responsibility to be informed, actively participate throughout the year, and, yes, even influence how our nation progresses!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd7p1SGMu...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2rglMZMV...

I teach in a parochial school, and have been teaching for over 25+ years. I do not and will not impose or push one political agenda over another. Please give us some credit! Our schools are comprised of the same type of kids as the one across the street from us and one down the street. The biggest difference...kids in my school are here because their parents want them to receive a Christan education. We teach, and preach Christ crucified. We don't teach elect Obama or McCain.

i'll try to summarize my points

--teachers will influence, as a parent you should understand that and be prepared for it

--private school parents usually understand what is being taught to their children (moral/Christian teachings), I don't believe that is always the case with public school parents

--parents are number one in teaching their children unfortunately not everyone does this

--Christians are not perfect, and I do agree that some use Christianity to further themselves in the wrong way. Some have evil intentions others are just human.

why_the_fuss - if your point is that all teachers are infusing their own political views into their teachings, then why is your original post only focusing on those schools where kids voted overwhelmingly for Obama? Why not focus on those schools where the kids voted for McCain? Because it sure didn't sound like you had a problem with the results in those schools. I take it then that it's ok to discuss politics in schools as long as the political views expressed match your own? I think I would rather have my kids in a school where they are free to form their own opinions. I will teach them at home what my values and beliefs are, and allow the school to be a place of learning through the exchange of ideas. I'd like my children to learn how to form their own opinions. How will they learn that if they are never exposed to opposing view points? I also think those of you who complain about teachers' views are cutting yourselves short as parents. Are you saying that the teacher has a stronger influence on your child than you do?

why-the-fuss...I am not trying to attack Christians. I am referring to a small but vocal group of people who pretend to Christianity in order to maintain and further political, rather than spiritual, ends. If I sounded as though I am trying to indict Christians in general, I apologize. I was really trying to speak only of those who use religion for their own purposes, which are almost always to further a political cause, many of whom have expressed such views often in these blogs.

Wow makr you are really out of touch if that is what you define as a Christian.

Christians are sinners as well and make mistakes/errors. Obviously there are many Christians that have made bad decisions; the Bible is full of them. I know I haven't always made the best decisions, but I believe I will be forgiven if I believe.

I certainly don't think I am better than you and if you feel that is what I am saying, you are certainly mistaken. My beliefs are important to me, and my hope is that someday maybe, you will take a look and not think I am so foolish.

localboy- "teachers who actually care about thier education" Are you serious? You really think public school teachers don't care about children's education. You have no clue.

Bella I'm so glad you summarized it so simply for all of us.

From my closed-minded opinion (at least that is what I think you are inferring) I was stating that teachers influence your children no matter if it is a public or private school. I have experienced both and I choose to have my children influenced by teachers who are more in line with my beliefs. This isn't to say that all public school teachers are bad; I don't believe that to be the case either.

I believe (my opinion) that there are teachers out there that go beyond teaching what they are supposed to and try to sway children into believing certain things are OK and not necessarily coming out and saying vote for X. But I guess that is why I am small minded and old fashioned.

Excellent comments, bella. These religious neo-cons HAVE to be right. They cannot accept that anything they dislike is anything but UNHOLY, UNGODLY, and EVIL. They all walk around with halos shining above their heads, and accuse the rest of us of being out of touch. They will look at one small element of a politician's overall plan, and label him a "socialist." (Medical care for all is hardly definitive, in and of itself, of socialism, but it's enough for these nut jobs.) They call themselves Christians, but think Christ was a sissy, a "bleeding-heart liberal" who turned the other cheek instead of seeking an eye for an eye. They quote the Old Testament incessantly, but meet references the New Testament with snide snickers. Well--Christ showed up in the NEW Testament--but that just doesn't suit their long-held hatreds, so they have to make adjustments. They think that God is a pretty good guy, but not very competent, so He needs them to fix His mistakes. They are God's closest advisors. Whenever God is in a quandry as to what to do next, He seeks their counsel. to It is only too apparent that they don't even believe their professed religion. Their "religious" beliefs are really just a loosely-held political ideology.

Local boy-You missed my point. Many people excuse public schools of a bias, yet private school parents purchase it. Why would you assume that public schools have more bias? I believe many of these responders need to spend more time in a public school. Go volunteer on a day off. You will be surprised how well you taxes are
spent. Why the fuss- Private schools are fine, particularly in Janesville. They may not have the frills of public schools. However, if public schools have frills or not, why do we assume a public school bias? Also, public schools have to meet state and federal standards and are held accountable by government testing. Private schools do test, but are not particularly accountable to the state or city. Public schools have to test or teach children from private schools that have learning disabilities. Your local public schools actually work quite well, and according to my wife, don't have a lot of time to be worried about spinning an election.

When I picked my son up from (public) school, he told me that voting was fun! They each got to go into a booth and cast their vote. Maybe this will help when they get to be of voting age, more than 30% of the population will actually vote. Whether they vote for Obama or McCain is not the point. They are learning what voting and the entire process is all about. I think it's great. I also think it's interesting how all the public schools voted versus most of the parochial schools.

It's hilarious reading these comments. So let me get this right...if you go to public school, you are subjected to these horrible, socialist teachers and you vote for who they tell you to vote for. But if you go to a religious private school, you are the result of a solid family unit that has taught you well and you have righteous teachers who encourage you to "do the right thing"? Neo-cons out there, you give hypocracy and paranoia new meaning every day!! Yesterday, Palin managed to compare Obama and the Democrats to "totalitarian dictatorships", and refer to socialist societies as "countries where people are not free". You know, dictatorships like France, Sweden, Norway, and the like. Just one incredibly ignorant remark after another from that one. And yet, you are going to vote for them! Maybe your kids are smarter than you. Have you considered that possibility?

Ah yes, there is hope for the future!!!

All these voters are in the 40% of people who don,t pay taxes.

When you are young you vote with your heart. When you get older, you vote with your head.

When you are young your vote with your heart. when you get older you vote with your head.

Janesville is heavy democratic city. With the UAW and teamsters in the area who tell you who to vote for and take you union dues to help endorse a candidate. It's no wonder the vote came out the way it did. I would like to see the last time Rock county has voted for a republican President.

Why_the_fuss: good comments. My daughter goes to St Paul's and I am pretty sure I know alot about the teachers and Principal at St Paul's, as we see each other in church every weekend and at the many church/school functions. I am very comfortable with St Paul's faculty. And yes it does cost me money, but my daughter is in third grade and is way ahead of public school third grade. My oldest daughter went to public schools and even she is amazed at the achievements of her little sister. just my opinion.

Hey, kid, you gotta remember that most of these neo-cons can't recognize, or understand, sarcasm. They feel that if it appears in print, it represent a committed position. I, for one, like your humor.

One thing about our old friend janesvillean--if you try to write something facetiuos, with a little humor in it, he will NEVER see the humor. He misunderstands virtually everything he reads, and then spends hours "explaining" the world to the rest of us. LAUGH once in while, pal. On the other hand, I guess you probably think that someone ought to take you seriously, even if it has to be you.

Way to go St. Williams, St. Patrick's and St. Mary's! And to your poor 16 souls at Rock County Christian, keep up the faith.

moco: my comment was sarcasm. i dont believe the teachers push one way or another...maybe to some degree the kids can tell by how the teaching is delivered but not enough to matter. i think its great they are teaching these kids about the election process and knowing the importance of being involved...

It's amazing what a billion dollars will get someone. This isn't breaking news. Young people have always tended to vote for democrats, because they don't pay any taxes.

Going to private schools isn't always the upper class -I'm certainly not upper class. However as local boy states, you don't have to worry about the politically correct crowd. Kids can learn about the important things as well as get a great education. Parents are also a lot more engaged in what goes on in the school.

Private schools are also able to teach a lot more with less. They don't need all of the latest frills to teach the students. Buildings don't teach students, teachers do.

And yes they are learning all of the same subjects as the public school kids. They just get a more complete view of the world and understand that social issues do matter and define who a person is.

My final point is that kids who go to private schools parents pay to have their kids go there and are well aware of what is being taught. In the public schools, that isn't always the case.

I have concluded that most Americans are psychic and that they know what is best for America. People actually think that they are voting for JUST a president, and that it is going to be the president, no one else, that makes or breaks the next four years. Americans seem to not be putting a lot of faith in themselves, as Americans. Both candidates have their own pros and cons, there is no right or wrong answer, on who to vote for. I sometimes find it humorous that when we are voting for someone to lead this country, the true colors of Americans really comes out. So many of us are ignorant, closed minded fools, and we can’t even see it. We don’t care WHO is president, just what we were taught from past generations of people on what a certain “group” believes… ie. Republican/Democrat. If you took away the faces of these people that are running for office, there is a chance that we could be voting someone that no one saw coming… we are all just voting for a “party” not a person. No matter which side claims the presidency, they are going to follow the party’s so-called “guidelines” like every past president has done. Also, what makes us think that the government doesn’t already know who the next president is going to be? We talk so much about not being bigots, or racist or things of that nature, but then you find out that someone is not voting the way you are and you jump down their throat and treat them like the scum of the earth. It’s amazing that we are perceived as the strongest country in the world when in reality we, as a team and role model for other countries, fail. We see wars, terrorism, bailouts, poverty, drug lords, abuse… and yet we still try to tell other countries how to run their governments. Amazing.

As others have said, children get their initial political views from their parents. Also, the views of the retirement-age population wouldn't be represented by the parents of elementary school children.

greatplain - that is the beauty of private schools. They are allowed to teach them what ever they want. That is the reason the parents send them to those schools and not the liberal public ones. It is not a matter of right or wrong, but getting your money worth, and a good God fearing education where you are allowed to pledge allegiance to the US (in the form of the flag). No worries about 'political correct' crap. Just a school full of kids with parents and teachers who actually care about thier education, and respond with participation. Go St. Paul's Flames!

Yeah, this really shouldn't be a surprise. The majority of students in the private schools are from upper class families (read: Republican). Not all of them, but certainly the majority. These results make perfect sense. Most kids just follow what their parents' political leanings are. However, it is a pretty cool activity for the city to do in order to get kids focused on voting at an early age.

Liberal leaning town with liberal leaning children? And where is the surprise in this? I do believe it is the parents teaching their children and not the teachers. At least in most cases. I know there are Christian teachers in the public schools who are voting according to their beliefs and not what the union tells them to do.

After looking at these results closely, how do we know the private schools are teaching government and citizenship correctly? Certainly their is a social issues focus, but are these religious teachers teaching
voting with an open mind? They seem to have a bent to the right. That
isn't fair and balanced, private or not.
This election is about class. St. Williams and St. Pats vote for Obama,
and all the other private schools vote McCain. That's about money and
access folks.

One of the great freedoms of living in America is being able to express what we think of each candidate. Regardless of the outcome, I will respect the position of presidency, and the person who aquires it.

Polls also showed in the past elections that Kerry and Gore were ahead and look what happened. Oh that's right they were stolen as the left wing mantra states- sorry had to throw that in because you know all right wingers speak from the same talking points but it never happens the other way. It is always well thought out arguments.

Polls are exactly what the pollster wants them to be, the last two pollsters that came to my door tried to appear unbiased but by the 3rd or 4th question it was pretty obvious who they were there for.

As far as teachers, I'm sure there are some that hold their views to themselves and good for them, however I had plenty that didn't. Luckily my mom and dad brought me up right.

thekid and whythefuss: C'mon. Teachers are not teaching or pushing kids one direction or the other. To think that is obsurd and is a slam on the teachers. Yeas WEA will tell the teachers to vote democratic but that does not mean that all will. I know for a fact that my wife won't and she is a teacher.

This is the work of parents at home. Just the other day my child came home and told me that a boy in her class told everyone that their parents needed to vote for Obama and not McCain and he actually listed off reasons for doing so. First graders have no business speaking about this and the parents should be ashamed that they are using their son to promote any party.

How clueless all of you dems are. Each day it grows closer to you winning the election the closer our country comes to becoming even worse off than it is right now. I didn't know there were that many socialists living among me.

janesvillean- I agree they predicted the last 12 of 13 because most kids vote the way there parents do and not the way their teacher told them.

Obama talks a good game, my guess is if he is elected it will be the same old thing, not the "change" some of the bloggers believe.

Yeah, I love the "intelligent" crowd because they obviously know more than paranoid little me. I graduated from college and found that most of the intelligent folks I ran into tend to lack in the areas of common sense and real world experience.

Just because you think you have the answer to everything, doesn't mean you are necessarily right.

I'm just glad my kids are growing up understanding what is really the most important thing, and it certainly isn't anything either candidate is promising.

If that makes me scared and superstitious, that is fine by me.

These votes reflect what parents teach their children. It represents the
talk around the dinner table. That's why Dems won in 2000 and 2004,
but not nationally.
Blaming it on the schools is easy. My wife is a teacher, and she is told
not to discuss her views, but help the kids understand all viewpoints.
She also teaches facts and does not not throw emotional social issues
around. That is how the right wing indoctrinates members through media everyday!

why_the_fuss (and markr and others for that matter), children's political views generally resemble those of their parents. If this reflects anything it is the Janesville Democratic lean. I bet it would be almost perfectly accurate at predicting the Janesville vote by itself.
.
The Weekly Reader poll just came out, and that has accurately predicted 12 of 13 elections (the exception being 1992 with the large Perot vote). The results were 55% Obama, 43% McCain. Since it's a national poll it's more likely to be in tune with the actual popular vote.
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/Th...

Liberalism has always held sway amoung educators. College campuses have always been liberal hotbeds. In other words, wherever intelligent, thoughtful individuals gather in fairly large numbers, liberalism carries the day. Wherever scared, superstitious people gather, conservatism is more in vogue.

There is no doubt that there is a liberal push happening in our school systems. What other direction would be promoted by the teachers union? And if any of you think we are getting anything different than old school politics you are in for a big disappointment.

Maybe we should have listened to the kids in the last two elections......... we probably wouldnt be in the same situations we are in now. i.e. War, the world in general hates us, the begining of a second great depression, feel free to add others.....

Has no one notice!
..
Since 1992, the “children’s” polls picked Democrats every time.
..
At least the “education system” has been consistent in the indoctrination!

I dont believe that senator Obama is just a fad. Most young and informed americans like myself are just tired of the old school politics. Someone young and fresh with a different idea is going to be a welcome change when he wins on Nov. 4th!

I feel bad for these kids. Now "polert" will be handing McCain/Palin buttons out on Halloween instead of candy. Geez, what was I thinking? He was going to do that already.

good point whythefuss:'Be aware parents, teachers may not just be teaching your kids reading and arithmetic' theyre obviously teaching them about politics and how to be involved. how dare they...

this is what happens before americans are programmed to panic upon hearing a scary ethnic name or the very mention of soc***ism.

I wouldn't read into the results too much. The results likely mirror how most of their parents will vote. Also, kids at that age tend to follow the fad or the flavor of the month and right now that is Obama

im a junior at parker and my school did a mock election as well and more than half of us chose obama...in our us history class we did a mock election on the computers and that also won with more than half of us voting for obama.

Imagine that, the schools overwhelmingly voted for Obama. And people say the teachers don't influence the kids at all. I am guessing if you polled the teachers, the results would be about the same-can't say I have run into many that would vote Republican.

Be aware parents, teachers may not just be teaching your kids reading and arithmetic.

Thankfully my daughter goes to St Pauls...

Obama have the grade school children fooled? Who would have thought?

I wonder if these schools teach the children that regardless if their candidate won or lost, and if you don't agree with the President, you still have to respect the position? Probably not.