Since our governor thinks that corporations are more important than an education and has taken away millions from education to shift to the big corporations, I think that the big corporations should be paying the taxes for education. That would solve alot of problems. Teachers and taxpayers will be very happy.

I love it when certain posters make comments that pertain to themselves, especially when they make a qualifying statement like"" The contract were pushed through"", then follow it up with a comment like ""This is what stupidity looks like"""
Iriss , I couldnt have said it better myself, your misinformed post is EXACTLTY what stupidity looks like, when oh when will you wake up from your stuper??

Raise the taxes

saywhat - Janesville School District no longer has a district AD. There is simply a teacher/AD at each high school.

One way to say is to eliminate the "district athletic director." As an athletic official I have experienced a great deal of disorganization. Each high school has its own AD who should be able to do the duties the "district AD is doing."

gonfo5 - I 100% agree, parents are a huge piece of the puzzle when it comes to educating children. When we look at the small amount of time children spend with teachers at school, teachers can make a difference, but a child’s success can be magnified by supportive parents and a supportive family life. Most teachers are hard working and effective, but if the child comes to school without sleep, without good nutrition, or with family stress hanging over his/her head, the learning that can take place at school is minimal. I agree that parents need to be held more accountable.

There are many differences between the public and private sector. Nothing is perfect and there are certainly advantages and disadvantages to each. The same is true of unions. Believe me, I’m all for getting rid of ineffective and bad teachers. And I do not believe that longevity should equal a higher salary. Teachers have to prove they are effective too, and most do. For the most part, a union is not going to protect a bad teacher. But principals also need to step up here; they need to know what’s going on in their school, who’s doing what, and have the balls to take action when someone is just not performing. Janesville is a community where everyone knows everyone and I believe that sometimes friendships get in the way of people getting rid of bad teachers.

Going back to the bigger issue though, I feel that teachers should not open their contract. The Janesville community cannot connect teachers not opening their contract to teachers being selfish, not paying their “fair share,” or not deserving what they earn. Teachers are NOT responsible for the state of this community. I know families are hurting and cannot afford increased taxes, but valuing education and electing a competent Janesville School Board should be the focus here. And again, Janesville should have been raising taxes slowly and gradually when we were thriving.

letsbehonest - I'm not angry by anymeans and I too think education in general is very important but the real problem is parenting! Until parents actually give a crap about their childs upbringing you are fighting a loosing battle with education. Not all are but we have an epidemic of worthless, lazy parents that think as long as XBOX or the kids cell phone can keep them out of their way then life is good.

The difference between public and private sector is there was no money budgeted to cover my salary. I must generate more money than cost to prove my worth and that gets judged every two weeks when payroll is figured. If what I do doesn't make money for the company than I'm simply not needed. Scary but a fact of life that many American's are unwilling to accept.

gonfo5 - In my opinion, the majority of teachers work very hard and do incredibly valuable work. I personally believe that the US does not value education. With that said, yes, teaching is a hard job. I'm not necessarily saying it’s harder or more valuable than other important jobs. As I said before, there are many difficult jobs out there. However, the difference is that teachers, the media, and John Q. Public do not have an opinion about you making too much or not paying your "fair share." But teachers are judged because tax payer dollars help fund education? The way that teachers are paid is very complex. The benefits are nice (not Cadillac, but nice), but there have been many, MANY years of sacrifice in salary for those benefits. The former QEO did not allow teachers to get standard of living raises. They took benefits instead. We have to keep the bigger picture in mind. And it's not black and white like many people outside of the profession believe. You work hard and probably deserve more. And teachers work hard too. But teachers are (for the most part) the only ones being judged, and they are left feeling defensive.
I know that raising taxes is going to be difficult for everyone. But education is worth it; our Janesville children are worth it. And teachers are at the heart of education, caring for and educating each and every child who walks through those school doors. Anyone who believes that teachers are in it for the money or benefits has not been in the schools recently. I’m sure any Janesville Elementary School would welcome your observation for a day.

If you're angry, you should be angry at the Janesville School Board. We could have been raising taxes slowly, in very small increments when Janesville was doing great, and avoiding tax increases now when our community is hurting.

One more comment regarding the 'tools' that Gov. Walker is suggestion and the idea that having a union for public workers is a bad thing.

What is to stop someone for working hard to get elected in a local setting, only to cut and gut every budget they get there hands on for the purpose of showing that they are 'tough' on spending. While they are doing all of this, they are constantly networking with other's and showing their 'resume' of budget mastery. All the while, others that aren't as bold to take the risk of publicly exploiting labor for the purpose of saving some tax dollars (but wish they were) are contributing to this person's campaign.

After a few years, the issues that start to surface with the original budget planning that was done will be old news and the responsibility of the new person in charge. A person with this type of agenda doesn't any longer need to worry about the aftermath of such actions. Instead, they only need to work to get elected to higher office on the merit of being a 'budget hawk'.

That people, is the best example of true leadership that this state has had in a long time. I think that if we had more people like Gov. Walker in the world, we would have just enough chaos in the world that everyone would avoid commitment and personal responsibility. We would be to the point of blaming everyone else for the problems THEY regardless of who caused it. And, we could just chastise them for not having enough pride and decency to just fix the issue.

ohhappyday -- Your welcome for the link. I do agree with part of your sentiment that everyone needs to tighten their belt and pitch in a little extra during tough economic times. That mentality in and of itself is the only way that people will successfully make it through a recession. However, I don't think that giving up one's ability to negotiate collectively is going to do that. This is the key focus of the plan Walker has put forth.

The idea that communities will have more 'tools' to handle their budgets is the key message that he keeps putting out there. Yet, his approach is actually akin to someone taking away someone's tool box and giving them specific tools to fix something.

Much of the idea behind his plan is that by getting rid of collective bargaining, those in charge of budgets will be able to put in place measures to trim a budget that would otherwise not be accepted by the group in its entirety. Things like increasing contributions to benefit plans, changing defined benefit plans to defined contribution plans, and switching from the current healthcare plan to a private plan are some of the specifics being implemented by the districts that are now using these tools.

Sure, it did help their budgets in most cases. But these approaches are just taking the cheap way out for the short term. It would be the same for someone that was coming up short on bills to change their home-owner and auto insurance plan to one with less coverage and higher deductibles to save some money. That approach works well in the short term, until a claim needs to be made. Then the situation gets worse.

Bottom-line, much of these solutions Gov. Walker talks about are little more than one way of doing things. Yet, with his contempt for unions that he developed when they would not just go along with HIS plans is what has led to this law being created. There are almost always options when addressing a problem. Yet, it takes a certain kind of individual ignore all but his own suggestions for the sake of being right.

Iriss: You have no clue about all the crap you are spewing. You need to listen to some others on this article. What planet or state are you living in Iriss? Not in the state of Wisconsin I guess, because you don't know what is really going on in our state.

Use the extra money this year and let WALKER know that you have had enough of his garbage. He needs to be recalled and the necessary money needs to be restored to education. I find it hard to believe that so many of the people here just don't get it. This is not about a school board, Supt., teachers, etc - this is about a governor that has removed over 800 million dollars that is needed for the education of our students. I can see that some budget cuts could have been by Walker, but this man has no education and does not value the importance of a quality education for kids. He would rather follow the Koch doctrine for big business and ultimately is destroying the educational futures of our children. Walker's actions are as bad as Paul Ryan buying 2 $350.00 bottles of wine and ramming down our throats that we need to tighten our belts for his Path TO Prosperity.

I hope you all get happier before the school year starts!

Germancaveguy - appreciate you finding that for me. I knew I had read something to that effect. Either way, people do need to give, especially with the economy the way it is. I have personally seen a city which was close to the size of Janesville "get all boarded up" with the loss of manufacturing jobs. We aren't "picking on teachers," just stating they need to pitch in at the same time as the rest of us have.

westorbust let me get this straight? So by your standards because a teacher is responsible for education which they are paid to do their jobs are automatically harder and more important than anything else? If this is so, please step down from your high horse to the real world for a while! And let me guess, you are a teacher?

ThinkFuture is right, it is a deal. To all the homeowners who are resisting an increase in your taxes, just imagine what this town will be like if the school system fails. According to some the district is running bare bones. Yeah I know, some people don't have kids in the district, so they say why do my taxes have to go up? The only thing I can say to that is, if you can find a community who doesn't tie property taxes to school funding I say go for it. But we live in Janesville, you own property, you pay taxes to fund the school district. Without the school district in Janesville what do we have? A bunch of borded up warehouses and companies that left the community. The school district is the only thing that Janesville has going for it right now. Support it or the entire community will go right into the Rock River.

onehappyday -- The contract that you are talking about is regarding the school district staff that aren't teachers. These numerous articles being ran by the Gazette are about the teachers contract.

Here is a link to one of the articles regarding the contract you write about:

http://gazettextra.com/news/2011/feb/21/...

Essentially, the idea that even this contract was rushed through is political in nature. The members of this Union had been negotiating the contract for over a year and a half. As to what particulars where causing the finalization to be stalled, I do not know. However, it appears that those issues weren't worth arguing over if it would mean they would loose their collective bargaining. So, they worked with the school board to finalize it before the new bill became law.

Much of the provisions in the Budget Repair bill seem like great 'tools' to cut budgets. But, if you were on the other end of that 'tool', I doubt you would be all that happy. Just like anyone else, the workers of the school district are fighting to retain their jobs and security. The same thing that any other hard working American does.

ohhappy, the school board approved the secretaries contract before Walker's bill went into law. I think they did that, because they had just agreed on a contract with the other union (custodial or something like that) before Walker's bill. In otherwords, I think teachers and custodial had their contracts done before Walkism and then the secretaries got theirs before Walker's bill was law. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

hdonlybob - Thanks for one positive note.I did notice there are some very unhappy people here, especially one in particular. This is just a discussion.

I do remember something being signed right after Gov. Walker made public his plans and people being upset with Janesville for hurrying up and pushing it through. I don't have the desire, nor the time to research it because it is water under the bridge and I am sure one of these people working for the school district won't locate it, only locate what is in their favor.

OK Lar80...let's compile all your taxes put directly into local public education. What do you guesstimate an average Janesville Joe pays over his lifetime in federal, state, local, income, sales, and property taxes that ends up directly in the budget of our local school district?
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I am confident the amount is a bargain compared to the per year costs of quality higher education. It hurts to think you might be getting services paid for with tax dollars efficiently, huh?

Thinkfuture
I really disagree with your reasoning/method.. You have imbibed the Kool-Aid or are a myopic genius.
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Public schools are funded only fractionally by local homeowner property tax. Federal and State input and grants supply massive dollars to public education. Ignoring this fact puts you in the Jon Stewart school of communication.
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Do you think those other dollars come from any place other than your taxes?

Whew! $100k+ teacher retirement health benefits paid out of instructional funds still safe.

Iriss, your ignorance on the matter is clear in your knowledge or lack there of, with the situation. The contract was not rushed through. In fact, it took over a year to get the contract settled last September. Scroll down and read a bit of the blogs and you'll get an education on what happened prior to Koch Walker taking office.

Iriss... the contracts were settled BEFORE walker was even elected! And did everone hear... all people who have contracts with Soddeman's business you can now renegotiate for low rates!

Let’s spell this out for the shortsighted.
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An average Janesville homeowner pays $2000 (high estimate) in direct property tax to the School District of Janesville each year. Let us say the average Janesville Joe & Jane pays this tax over the course of their entire local homeownership (50 years—another high estimate) for a grand total of $100,000. Of course, Janesville Joe & Jane have 2.5 kids who go through the K-12 system. Average the total school taxes (for 50 years) per kid and this equates to about $40,000 per kid. What an unbelievable bargain!
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The average cost of 4 years of higher education exceeds $40,000. In the School District of Janesville, my kids receive 13 years of education for $40,000! Also, consider that Jane/Joe can spread those educational costs over the course of their homeownership! Not only that…the same $40,000 keeps crime down (and the costs associated with that), enriches the culture (athletics, plays, musicals, art shows, academic offerings) of Janesville, supplies an educated workforce for local businesses, and endows great green spaces and facilities that can be used from time to time.
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Topping off this incredible deal is the economic reality that these same tax dollars (unlike higher education costs) funnel through Janesville’s businesses countless times (through SDJ employee spending and the dollars spent through local businesses/professionals that support our school system).
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My taxes to the SDJ are a steal for the K-12 education my kids receive and the myriad fringe benefits. Raise my taxes!
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Public schools = the soul of our community. Nurture it!

I think one of the biggest problems with this situation is the fact that too many people are looking at problems in a very shortsighted way. So many of the solutions proposed handle the matter that is coming up. Yet, there is always a new crisis around the corner.

Much of the problems that the school district faces are similar to other government budgets. The solution being pushed by many is to cut teacher compensation for the sake of keeping taxes down. Yet, this solution causes problems as well.

We live in a society that constantly expects growth. Yet, when we have growth, we also have inflation. Despite this fact, people assume that budgets like the school district's can stay fixed so that taxes don't rise.

I've read a lot of comments regarding how the SDJ needs to budget like families do. Yet, I don't know anyone that gets rid of things they have when money is good. If the cost of living goes up while a persons wages do, they pay the cost. It is only when a problem happens, such as loss of income, that the idea of cutting expenses comes into play.

However, even when this happens, most people don't just give up. If there current employer is paying too little, they look for a better paying job. If they have a way of keeping things, such as savings, they use that before they cut expenses.

What is being asked of the SDJ, to not raise taxes, is purely political. If they are able to raise taxes to make up the loss in revenues, then they should. But beyond that, they should manage the revenues in such a way as to keep future problems to a minimum.

Just like every other employer that has struggled to make budgets work, the SDJ is looking to solve the problem on the backs of their workers. This approach isn't right when it happens anywhere.

People need to stop championing those at the top of an organization for making ends meet by exploiting the savings they can gain from their workers.

Would any of you champion a person that continues to eat steak every night but only feeds their kids mac and cheese so that the bills get paid?

stevev- were you the waterboy on the football team that was jealous of all the other jocks? understand what high school athletics does for any young man or woman....it builds character, teaches them life lessons, develops their morale...that list could go on and on....dont tell me that sports, art or music are not part of a students education. you are totally wrong there! not to mention, i know MANY families that will pack up and open enroll their students....do some research of that financial disaster for the district. you might be down sucking water for the water bottles from the mighty turtle creek real soon!

What a difference a day makes! Wake up anfind that the district has an extra $3 million from last year! Where did it come from? Was the healthcare claims low again? Will the district honestly tell the public after the audit? Thank god the teachers didn't agree to Nylons bill amendment and open their contract. I'm sure they will be begged again next year. The board should still raise my taxes a little so that the district gets more next year.

...btw, it also reflects the top down, CEO mentality that value is directly related to monetary concerns. Schools are not factories, though with the standardized education and politically correct policies, they certainly do reflect factories, and that is not the fault of teachers.

@gonfo5, So by your standard, because the cook at Denny's or the laborer at Stoughton Trailers works hard, is underpaid and under appreciated, their jobs are just as important as the teachers that are charged with the mandatory education of entire generations of children? Ok then. I suppose it comes down to what a person values, and for many here, as I can see, education is not one of them, which reflects the manufacturing heritage of Janesville. It's just a job.
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The angst people feel against public workers and their pay/benefits is solely because the private sector has done a wonderful bang up job of nearly abolishing all unions and convinced people that they are getting "what they deserve" and that their corporate profits save the planet and are part of some kind of holy biblical plan. Most people hate to pay taxes----people's wages go down, jobs are lost----look at those public workers and teachers over there, how come they still get the goodies-----NOT FAIR! blah blah blah. Most of the arguments against teachers and public workers have been straw men, exaggerations and justifications to advance a particular ideology with no real basis in reality.

Let the parents that have children in the schools make up the difference and not place the burden onto seniors and those that have no children.

ohhappyday,
Welcome to the unreal world of posting your opinion here.....
As you can see, you get attacked personally instead of a respectful disagreeing comment.
However I respect and thank you for at least having the gumption to post your thoughts...
Statements like "move out" coming from one who can't even spell my name correctly don't have much merit, as you have to consider the source...
And as for the teachers contract, yes it had been in NEGOTIATIONS for a long time but WAS pushed thru by the school board due to Walkers position.
Now they are complaining about budget. This is irresponsible...period.

This isn't a dig at teachers but my question is why are they put up on a pedestal all the time with they are the biggest givers and most non appreciated workers? I'd be willing to bet if you polled 500 different workers from many walks of life you would get mostly the same responses from all of them that they don't always feel appreciated at work. Last time I checked, that's why we receive paychecks for our services, not to mention if it were suppose to be easy than why is it called "WORK"? If it were easy, we would say in the morning, "Honey, I'm headed into FUN today"! I know, I threw a little humor in there but my point is every job is hard and has its pitfalls in its own way. That doesn't make anyone's job any harder/easier than the others, unless you are a military person deployed to combat, then your job trumps them all!

Can someone explain to me why my tax money is going to fund kids playing sports at school and why this is considered untouchable? I would think that something that doesn't directly add to the education of children should be the first thing on the chopping block.

How about including music and art at the middle and high school levels to the "do not touch" list. Don't even go there. Meanwhile, apparently there's 3 million left from last year to plug this hole - so, will that be the end of this drama? Doubt it.

I'll pay higher taxes. In exchange I'd like the teachers union to break from the illusion of entitlement and begin contributing a reasonable amount to benefits costs.

B8nksboy- I was unaware and you should feel proud of your decision to help during difficult times. It is commendable that your employer acknowledged the choice you made with meaningful action. I wonder if all of the years of feeling unacknowledged has left the teachers feeling less optimistic that their district/board/community would ever feel satisfied? It doesn’t matter if our community is doing well or is hurting, teachers are consistently underappreciated-it’s important to keep the bigger picture in mind. People can only give so much and teachers everywhere are giving; spending their personal money for school supplies, their personal time for clubs, athletics, professional development, etc. Many jobs expect overtime, but teaching takes it to another level. Just because everyone has been a student in a school at one time does not mean they know what it is like to be a teacher today. I know teachers who have given thousands of dollars (no joke) and thousands of hours (seriously) in a single year with no gratitude. Inviting non-teachers to work as a teacher for one week would open so many eyes. There are many difficult jobs in this world, I’m saying teaching is one of them. I’m sure your job has its own unique challenges and you probably deserve to earn more for your hard work. It would be hurtful to hear that you deserve to make less, that you’re not worth what you make, and this is the message we continuously send to teachers. Again, we even send this message to teachers when the economy is doing well! Unfortunately, education is not valued in our society. Many believe it’s not even worth $56 a year. I am happy for you and the way your situation turned out, I am not hopeful that it would turn out the same for Janesville’s educators. :(

I am proud to say I am a teacher but I am so disgusted at some of these comments. For any of you that are teacher bashing, please come volunteer for a day in a classroom and see what a teacher does. I love my profession and am always proud to say that I am a teacher. But nowadays, not so proud to say I teach in Janesville.

I think it is interesting that Soda Pop (aka Bill Sodemann) keeps on hammering on the teachers. When is he going to ask Dr. Schulte to forego her bonus??? OR.....stop paying for administrators to get their doctorate degrees. Come on, Bill. Stop being a "teacher hater"!

"School quality is considered one of the most influential
factors on housing prices in the United States. Empirical studies have shown that
there is a positive relationship between school quality and housing prices"
Source:http://business.fullerton.edu/finance/journal/papers/pdf/forth/accepted/The%20Effect%20of%20School%20Quality%20on%20Residential%20Sales%20Price.pdf
********

In other words, if you are a home owner in this district, you should be begging for your taxes to be raised to support the schools. (Unless you don't care that your biggest investment won't give you the returns that it should.)

“Research shows that the single most attractive strategy for luring business and middle-income people to a community is to maintain a top-quality school system. Good schools are associated with good property values, a low juvenile crime rate and a temperate tax rate.”
Same source as previous post.

"They reported “a robust finding among this group of cities is that high-quality school districts provide services valued in excess of the higher taxes that they levy.”
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“In city after city, it’s customary for a house to be worth at least 10% more than a comparable house across the street if that street is the boundary line between a highly rated school district and a laggard. In some cases, houses in the best school districts cost almost twice as much as those nearby.”
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“if a community increases its tax rates and employs the receipts to improve its school system, the [statistical] coefficients indicate that the increased benefits from the expenditure side of the budget will roughly offset (or perhaps even more than offset) the depressive effect of the higher tax rates on local property values.”
SOURCE:http://www.patriotroad.com/articles/detail/educational_quality_facilities_and_real_estate_value/

b8nksboy: Do you really think that would happen with teachers? Do you think we will ever make up that loss?

hey -letsbehonest ya know what? that actually happened last year to all of the skilled trade unions. All of the large contractors i.e. findorff, cullen, tri-north asked all of us to take a reduction in pay raises. the carpenters were the only ones to concede. and this year they gave us all of the money that would've been spread through four different trades. and the others? they got nothing!

Thank god, banksboy! Remember that next time you vote for school board. Peace and good night all. Way to go BREWERS!

Allfor1: See, I'm trying to do you a favor by helping you to quit smoking.

Allfor1- hey I do agree with you on that soderman dude. this guy is more worried about his local status in the community, than the school system. He isn't whats best for Janesville period. He's what wrong with this backwards thinking town!

Caddyshack, $55 is too much. We have paid less than 1% increase over the past 10 years, and now you want us to pay an increase that big? I can almost get a carton of smokes for that price.

For anyone who believes that teachers should open their contract, let's try reversing the situation. Whoever you are and whoever you work for, let's say your boss comes to you and says your company is $2 million short this year. Although your boss has agreed to pay you a certain amount for the next two years, he gives you two options. 1) Take a $5,000 pay cut now or 2) take a $5,000 pay cut in two years after your agreement is up. I believe that anyone, even those with the biggest heart and love for their job, would take the pay cut in two years. This allows time to prepare their family for the devastating cut. Most people do not get a choice when it comes to taking a pay cut, but unfortunately, teachers in Janesville have a choice. I believe that most teachers are amazing people, with bigger hearts than you can imagine. Although they want to help during this stressful time, helping the district and community also means hurting their family. Teachers are not selfish for making this choice.

KLC: you gave it a shot! Seriously, though, this is a community issue, and our community is in dire straits. I am sure that you can understand why the average teacher may be reluctant to volunteer 5.8% (or more) of salary per year, perhaps $2000 to $4000 or so, when members of our community balk at a tax increase of $55 per year.

Okay-allfor1
6cr. x 300=1800
5yr. x 100= 500+1800=2300/5= $460peryr

Seriously?!!!!....I pay 2x that amount in one month for benefits!
You are going to have to do better than this, to change my mind!!!!

alfor1 - WOW. Yes, I do think most pro athletes play because they love the game.

ohhappy, why don't you ask the school board president to give you the healthcare data for the last ten years or so? I'm sure he won't want to share all that golden information, because it would make the teachers look good.

banks, funny you should mentioned construction. My buddy is working on the interstate (state contracted) and is making $40 plus dollars an hour to run a heavy duty machine. He loves his job and gets a lot of overtime hours. He has a high school education and training on the machines he works on. He is often layed off for three months in the winter and gets to collect unemployment. He has nice benefits and makes over $75,000 a year. Not bad is it. I do his taxes for and think it's great that he does so well for only working 9 months out of the year.

The Gap may have been a goldmine for 3 years, but it could also go the other way real fast. Kind of like playing a slot machine. The horse blinders are signing off for the night!

happy: I especially love my own children and I will fight to provide for them. Not many of my teacher friends own vacation homes and country club memberships. Most teachers are average schmucks who are asking to be left alone while we whittle out a decent living for our families. Not many of us are sending our kids to private Ivy League colleges out East. By under taxing when Janesville was capable we are now buried with budget shortfalls. Poor vision by school board leadership.

Good banksboy, go to the state and have them change the law stating that all teachers need to get 6 credits every 5 years and pay $100 to keep their license.

**sigh**

Come on happy, you think pro athletes just play their sport because they love the game? Get real!

The Gap, Clougherty said, "has been a gold mine for this district for over three years."

A quote form M3 after they saw what the teachers healthcare insurance surplus was doing for the district.

and I thought they chose that profession because they loved children???????

How many of you go to school board meetings or watch them on TV? I've seen several dozen of them and read several of articles with Mr. Sodemann quoted. I don't believe I've once heard or read something positive that Mr. Sodemann has sincerely said about teachers. He will never share anything that teachers do in this district to help the budget. Instead he just blames them and throws them under the bus in my opinion. Watch a few meetings and be your own judge. It is embarassing to see and read. It is clear that he should not be a so-called leader that has anything to do with helping students, teachers, and staff become a great district. He clearly,in my opinion, only cares about the almighty dollar and saving the taxpayers a few bucks.

and this:

http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2008/feb...

These are dated, but may shine some background history on the insurance issue.

We used to watch Larry, Curly and Moe. Now we have Bill, Lori and DuWayne, what a fiasco watching these stooges in action. Those 3 own the problem and are doing NOTHING but spinning their wheels! Raise my taxes and let's get back to educating our kids. Bill and DuWayne do not make decisions that are good for students. Lori it's pathetic that YOU are putting this on the 3 unions waiting for them to cover mismanagement by you 3 stooges! Murray and Hesselbacher get it!

happy: here, read this:

http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2008/aug...

banksboy, tell me what you think a teacher should get paid. A teacher with 10 years experience, and a masters degree(30-40 credits) plus an additional 42 credits. 3 credits is one class and usually costs $300 or more per credit. What should they get paid. Just tell me what salary you think they should get. NO Benefits or healthcare. They can invest in their own investments and buy their own healthcare. What should they make?

Alfor1 - I guess we should just agree to disagree, you are on one side of the fence and me on the other. The simple solution as I said is that everyone should pay their fair share, no matter what business they are in.

ohhappy, pay a teacher with 10 years experience and a masters degree plus more credits $70k or so, or give them $55k and healthcare. Who pays for it? Teachers get a salary and benefits package. The district saves on taxes by giving them healthcare as part of their salary/benefits package. The district does not pay taxes on the $15,500 that they put into the teachers self funded healthcare. If they paid the teachers this and told them to get their own healthcare, they would have to pay FICA taxes on the $15,500. The districts saves about $500,000 a year by doing this. Like Jim Rief mentioned before, a healthy male could probably get healthcare for $8k or $10k instead of $15,500, monthly premiums, co pay, deductibles, and 80/20 after that.
Just because the board and the gazette doesn't share what teachers have or don't have in their deals, doesn't mean they have it so great.

OhHappyDay-keep looking with those horse blinders, they serve you well!

-Did you know that the local carpenters union fully funds it own pension and healthcare funds? 100%!! It can be done people.

This is a more about changing a delusional culture! The fact that a public sector of people receives better benefits than 95% of its taxpayers who pay their salaries is ridiculous! everyone in the private sector has taken their hits, teachers should not be so ignorant to think they are exempt!

happy: this gets repetitive, but the district budgets $15,500 per teacher for the self-funded insurance plan. This is taken out of the salary pool, and what is left is then dedicated to salary. Then we are charged an additional $2200 in annual premiums for a total of $17,700 for family insurance. So, while grateful for all of my compensation, my insurance is not "free". I pay $17,700 per year plus deductibles and co-pays. That has been bargained for through negotiations. The JEA has chosen to receive lesser raises in order to maintain current insurance and retirement benefits. The JSD will absolutely not give this up for they profit from over-charging us for the insurance.

And no, you did not pay for that teacher's babysitter any more than I paid for the Sentry cashier's babysitter while she was volunteering in community service.

Ohhappy, how is it end of problem? Even if they give in and pay the 5.8% earlier than 2013, they still will be pushed to give more and to cut more. $3.1 million this year might fill the current gap, but Sodemann and others have said that the gap will be 8 or 9 million next year. Then what? If they don't tax more now, they won't get higher funding next year. All the good years where GM and the economy were doing really well, the district didn't tax much and now it is coming back to bite them. You can thank many on this board for that. The past ten years the school tax levy has averaged less than 1%. In otherwords, the board did it backwards. Tax a little when people have jobs and money, and then tax more when they are broke and out of work. Not a good strategy, but keeping taxes low is all some board members care about.

The obvious and continuing disagreement is about the value of educators. One side believes that School District staff is worth every dime. The other side seems to believe that public employees are inherently overpaid. Persistent extolling of virtues or further disparaging of character will continue to leave this debate in limbo and further erode any sense of community or cooperation. Everyone who partakes in such acrimony is guilty.
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Both sides disagree on the argument to have - the solution exists in that very disagreement. Ask the teacher if it is about money or worker's rights. You'll get a fairly consistent answer. Ask a taxpayer that very same question and you'll get the opposite. It ought to be unrealistic to expect either side to give 100% to solve the economic problems. The teachers have no legal obligation to do so until 2013. Concessions on other orders (i.e. work conditions, personal day usage, and other extended good-faith gestures) along with respect and cordiality will go further than this tit for tat. All those hellbent on sustaining the constant stream of criticism of public employees is all but ensuring the debate end in a stalemate - of which the JEA will be guaranteed to win.
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I reiterate my previous statement: Arena of Ideas or Gladiator Arena. So far? This is Sparta.

My mistake, was the contract reopened around that time (February)? Also, allfor1, how can healthcare eat up their raises when they don't pay for healthcare?

The JEA membership voted the week before. The contract went to the Board for approval and passed on Sept. 21, 2010. Scott Walker had not even been elected yet.

ohhappyday, why should the teachers pay more of their premium when their self-funded insurance has a surplus at the end of the year? The district already keeps this surplus and places it in the fund 10 account. I could agree that they should pay more for their healthcare if they were draining the district, but as many have stated on here, the current healthcare set up is a CASH COW for the district. It's a moneymaker for them so they are not going to shop elsewhere for better rates.

Gov. Koch Walker had that repair bill ready long before he got into office. The Koch Bros. and many others had that bill all worked up and ready to go long before their pawn took office, IMO.

The contract was signed in September. Walker was elected in November and the budget repair bill was introduced in February. This contract was not "rushed through" based on Walker's plans.
http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2010/sep...

happy, can you read? They signed it in September of 2010. The contract is good dating back to 2009 and expires in 2013. A four year contract. Teachers worked all of 2009 without a contract and got it finally done in September of 2010. That is 3 or 4 months before doorknob took office. The teachers contract gives them a freeze for the first year and 1 or 1.5% the other years. And yes, healthcare eats up most of their raises anyway. If you ask them to pay the 5.8% which they will have to in 2013 anyway, you are asking them to take a $2,500 to $4,000 dollar pay cut. Walker cut over $800 million in school funding. This is the problem. He has everyone thinking that his cuts will save this state, yet he is spending elsewhere and giving tax breaks to big money. $59,000 he spent on his travel in six months so far. Not cutting much at all, is he?

School Board OK's Teacher Contract. Sept. 22, 2010.

http://gazettextra.com/news/2010/sep/22/...

Negotiations began May, 2009.

@ohhappyday- they signed sometime the previous summer I believe- maybe August or September.

When did the union sign their current contract? Governor Walker came out with his "budget repair bill" in February.

We don't need to hire a finance person. The simple solution - pay part of your health care premiums(at least 20%) and your pension. End of problem.

Not quite right happy day. Contects were voted and approved before walker became dictator. He didn't mention any plan to the public to do this union thing. That came later too. But there were several comunities who did do just that. That being said I'd like to address the other part. Many families have moved out some because of too many cuts to our schools some because of no work too high of taxes and nowhere to turn. There have been some very talented minds leaving this town and state. More people have moved out of here in the last 3 years then the gazette or school system wants you to know. I know because it is my job. My bussiness set records last year and the year before. Look around at all the empty houses near you and around town and tell me it isn't so. Point is we had better be carefull on these next desicions and not push a whole lot of people away or it will get worse than it already is.

ohhappyday- the contract was signed 3 to 4 months before Walker even won the election.

I would love it if people would look up housing costs in major metropolitan areas and compare them to Janesville.It is enormously inexpensive to live here and enjoy the quality of life we have. Taxes may seem high but they aren't and we receive many many public services that other cities pay extra for.We havea wonderful, safe school system that we should support. It is the future of our community. Lets' just pay a little extra in taxes and get the job done.

First, they need to tax the max. Our choices are few. Secondly, find a healthy school district of equal size and budget to compare with. Find what is working and flag off-base budgeted areas. I've never understood how a masters or doctorate in education, qualifies an individual to make large financial decisions. How about hiring a person in finance to foresee the financial health of a school district. This persons role alone would pay for itself in the long run. We need to rethink how schools operate as a whole.

sluggo - I am fully aware they were working without a contract, see how quick it got signed once Scott Walker came out with his plan.

Certainly didn't mean to insult you, but I am sure they did hurry and sign their contract as soon as Scott Walker came out with his plan. I did research it. Why can't you understand that they should reopen their contract and pay some of their health insurance and pensions, which I also did research. They pay none of it. Full benefits off of the taxpayer's back. If they don't like it, they should go into a different profession. What is truly sad is all of the young college graduates who went to school for teaching, but because of the greed of the teachers/union, cannot find employment. What goes around, comes around. I can remember when GM was in trouble before closing here in Janesville, when the teachers were complaining that they wanted what GM got (as far as pay, benefits, etc.). Well, be careful what you wish for. Yes, I do have children. And, no, that teacher didn't pay a baby-sitter, we did, the taxpayers.

Oh - and news - they can get laid of, just ask the hundred or so that were in the spring. The contract just has set dates for notification.

ohhappy- my goodness you couldn't have been reading these or you would know the teachers were working without a contract forever, and it was passed way before the governor was elected. I hardly call that rushed through.

Happy, you should do some research before you post for the first time. The teachers took over a year and a half to get their contract signed, so no, it wasn't rushed through anything. You can look at some articles from last September when it was signed 3 months before Wangker took office. The teachers took a freeze the first year of their four year deal. In addition, this district makes a ton of money each year off of the teachers' self funded health insurance. Why do you think the fund ten account keeps getting more money? If teachers took pay/salary instead of benefits, it would cost the district extra money in paying FICA taxes on the extra salary. Years ago they decided to give benefits because they didn't have to pay taxes on healthcare.

Do a little research before you make ridiculous posts blaiming teachers. Not sure if you have kids, but I appreciate all the teachers giving up their day and volunteering to work registration so my kids could be all set for school. One teacher even paid a babysitter to watch her kids, while she worked the registration for free.

I have never posted anything, but this has me on fire. Let me get this straight, and please correct me if I am wrong, the teachers union for Janesville was in a hurry to sign their contract, so as not to have to pay for ANY OF THEIR HEALTHCARE OR PENSION, not enough teachers were laid off, and oh, they all got their raises, but yet they are looking in our pockets for more? Where do they think more comes from? When the teachers/union can take this seriously, reopen the contract, and pay what they should have been paying for the last 50 years, then they won't need to raise taxes or cut programs. By the way, the last I heard, anyone who can move out of this over-taxed city, does. The difference between the GM union and the teacher's union is, we can choose to support GM by buying one of their vehicles, our choice, and, yes, the GM employees have contributed to their pensions and their health insurance, and the teacher's union just thinks they can tell us what they need and we will always be there to dish out more money. One more thing, I didn't think that Governor Walker's plan gave the option of higher taxes. Done.

"We want people to move here, and people are not going to move here if the school district does not have a product people want," Hesselbacher said." People are not going to move here if the taxes are too high...or did I miss something? Time for Hesselbacher to get her head out of her....I meant the clouds.

How did we get to not being able to layoff teachers with a contract? Any other union workplace can lay off employees as needed. GM was able to layoff people when conditions were bad. If the conditions aren't bad in the Janesville school system, I don't know what bad is.

Continuing to add to the hostility and Balkanization of the relationship between the pro-teacher and pro-austerity crowds will only serve to create an intrenched impasse. This goes to all involved and all observing, including the Board members, state your opinion with a simple rationale that doesn't include venom. This should come down to a vote based on equality, cooperation, justice, and reality - not on who does a better job shouting down or beating the opposition into submission. Arena of Ideas or Gladiator Arena - your choice.

That name of yours just doesn't seem appropriate, Allfor1and1forAll. Not when you tell a fellow citizen to suck it up or move. Besides, haven't you heard, Janesville needs people to want to move here. And remember what's most important to you, that Janesville needs as many taxpayers as it can get to keep you and/or yours on the payroll. If they listen to you and take a hike, you and/or your loved ones may soon get that layoff you fear. Or lose the raise you feel so entitled to.

So we want people to move here, do we? When they find out that that a house valued at $120000 is assessed $3000 a year, they aren't going to buy in Janesville, even if the schools were worth every penny of their share of the assessment, which they are not.

The school tax levy has averaged LESS THAN 1% OVER THE LAST 10 YEARS. So, donlybob, suck it up or move.

Closing any of these schools will only cost more money in the coming years. Keep them all open and tax more.

Sodemann says the reserves are taxpayers dollars. Many of the reserve funds have come from the extra money left over each year from teachers not spending all the money placed in their self-funded healthcare. Sodemann would never want anyone to know that teachers' healthcare account helps the district increase the fun 10 account, that would make them look positive.

Why does this remind me of the Tea party and the debt ceiling?

"Raise taxes? Unpopular and coming at a time when taxpayers' budgets are strained. On the other hand, the higher the taxes, the more state aid the district gets in the following year."
AND THIS IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF WHAT IS WRONG WITH OUR SYSTEM.....SPEND MORE TO GET MORE...AND WHO THE DEVIL DO THESE MORONS THINK THIS EXTRA "STATE" (AS IN YOU AND ME) MONEY COMES FROM..
This comment is pathetic, and shows the ignorance of our current elected officials....button up your britches, like all the rest of us have...may be tough, but it is reality, as well as honest...
Geesh......

Cut costs or raise taxes....of course, raise taxes!

"Stottler said employees might be uncomfortable as the board debated whether to lay them off, but it has to be done."
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I find this to be a very disappointing sentiment. I generally have found Commissioner Stottler to be a realistically compassionate public servant; however, in this case she lets down. I understand the need to debate cutting employees but there is a time to do that - that was back in April. Now it just serves to rattle nerves unnecessarily. Rationally, cutting people at this point in the game ought to be off the table.