Why was my comment removed Gazzet Staff? it was not offensive, it did not contain any foul language. Hmmmmmm nothing like silencing a voice you do not wish to be heard when it contradicts your special intrests.

This goes way beyond simply the teachers - although I understand why people want someone to blame. The thing to keep in mind is that education, no matter how much many would like to imagine, is not a business. Educators are not creating widgets. Educators are not working with equal raw materials. Educators are not creating a good - they are providing a specialized service in buildings that service nearly everyone directly at some point in their lives. Education is something a community needs to either value and support or something a community will undercut. If you don't like the state of schools in Janesville - look directly at your school board in its entirety. Some board members think of little more than the budget while others seem to have never heard of a bottom line. It is the job of the Board to ensure quality and affordable education exists in Janesville. What we see has happened over the past few years is a disintegrating education that is increasingly unaffordable - in beautiful buildings. I don't know what more of a signal this community needs to vote out the old and vote in new.

Stubby, I agree with you that the state backed away from its 2/3 commitment to fund K-12. Seaverson knew that when he voted on the budget last fall. Seaverson, not the state, voted for a flawed budget. I am not buying the finger pointing. He, and the rest of the Board, under the advice of Schulte created the mess.

older....your attitude is the problem...your unions are the problem.

My unions??? I don't belong to a union. Did once and it is the same as all unions. The employee has no choice but to join, regardless if they agree with the union or not., and the union does what it wants regardless of the members opinions.

What is the problem with my attitude? Not enough doom and gloom in it for you?

MooShoo - sorry but Seaverson is essentially correct. The state significantly reduced aid to schools in 10-11, but "generously" allowed the local districts to make up for some of the losses through local tax increases. Now Gov. Walker is planning to do even more of the same. The $10m deficit we have at the moment will probably seem paltry in a few months. The state is shifting the burden to the local taxpayer, and until some real school funding reform takes place at the state level, this problem is going to persist.

Jayem,
You are correct the US does spend more money per student than any other country because we educate every child until they are 18. Not just the average and good kids.
Redder,
While I agree with you our kids aren't that great at math and that we should get back to some basics, I disagree with you that teachers are spending so much money going to training paid for by you. Some (very few) do attend seminars for different things but the majority of the seminars are attended by administrators. Also if you think teachers don't pay for their training (classes required by DPI) you are misinformed for lack of better term. PERIOD

THIRD, and not final but you need to inspect what you expect..for an example, our mayh curriculum is the worst thing ever, kids dont know simple math...its horrible what happened to just plain old math...we come up with crap pay too much for it and then its plain stupid and we spend a crap load of money on another progam...this is simple waste of funds...why are these people not help accountable, look this country got someplace useing just basics we dont need fancy crap to educate we need plain old common sense and it seems we dont have it when it comes to education. If these teachers actually have to have all the time off that these kids get today, and all these stupid trips to classes that do nothing and seminars so they can get their drink on, LET THEM PAY FOR IT...a mechanic pays for his training, a sales person pays for hid tripd its called if you want to improve then pay for it if you learn and get better then you make more and advance...BUT in our give me something for nothing society, we poo poo this its all broken and a hard line needs to be taken to improve this situation...PERIOD

older....your attitude is the problem...your unions are the problem, FIRST, teachers should not have a union and they should not be allowed to strike...you dont like the system your in then QUIT...go somewhere else that might pay you what YOU think your worth...just like the rest of us in business. Second, education is subsidized by goverment, and taxes that is fine...however our administrators need to do a better job of searching for and negotiating with vendors, and those who supply them with goods. If you cannt afford it buy it elsewhere. That is a key issue, these people do not have a clue how to negotiate a contract, nor will they because they dont give a crap about what is going out. They get their heads onto a product or service and think they must have it and its over priced, and under performing.

Teachers as your neighbor I do not wish to deny you a decent wage and benefits. The people bashing teachers on here have no clue how good our schools and teachers are.

Ironic that the chant is, “we want better schools: less pay less tax”, but invariably when asked for an example of a good school system, it is one that has higher per capita wealth, and so of course, more money. If schools are going to be a government enterprise, there will be waste, fraud, kickbacks, politics in the paybacks, and every other bad thing about how the government operates, so it will be expensive. Suck it up and pay, or shut up about better schools and teachers. You can’t have your cake and eat it to.

Whatever compensation package the teachers have, the public, in the guise of elected representatives gave what they have to them. The teachers union has very little power to affect salaries and compensation directly. Without the ability to strike and shut down operations, which because it is a government operation, wouldn’t really matter, they are not going out of business or even loosing revenue, the one power a strike has over an employer is moot. (Teacher union power is in political lobbying. Getting tax and spend liberals into office is their real power for influencing teacher compensation).

Don’t blame the teachers for trying to get the most pay and benefits they can.
WHO DOESN’T.
Anyone one out there that does not want more compensation?…. Hello,,, anyone…??
Anyone think they do not deserve the compensation they get?… Hello,,, anyone…??
Anyone want to give back some of their compensation to their employer? Well….

Severson said it's not the board's fault.

"State officials have pushed off on the local taxpayer the burden of education," he said.
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HORSE APPLES!
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YOU voted for a budget last fall that was full of stimulus funds and balance sheet spending as well as cost increases!
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You created the problem, now FIX it and quit playing the blame game.

Bookworm, here is your answer:

"At the same time, the board set the school property tax levy at $35.88 million, a 3.17 percent increase from last year."

The property taxes were raised 3.17% when the Board adopted the current budget last fall.

i still haven't seen the answer to my previous question. when was the last time school taxes were raised?

Well school board, I'm sure you're lurking and reading. Now you know how we feel.

Say what ? Jim Reif a teacher thinks we ought to pay more taxes. Listen BUCKO!! we are tired of your approach, lets eliminate expenses. That means maybe you Jim

SuperDave is onto something. How many of the state and federal mandates are imposed on us but are unfunded? What are the exact costs of unfunded mandates?

The solution...get gubmint OUT of the education bidness. Separation of School and State, if you will. There is NO reason that gubmint should have its tentacles in the schools.
Freedom for all. Free markets, including the education market.

In order to guide the school district through this rough patch, the school board needs to take a lean and frugal approach. Anyone allocating public funds must ALWAYS spend as sparingly as possible, and anyone who works for the public sector must expect that too. Ultimately when the essential components of education and the nice-to-have but expendable ones have been sorted out, tax adjustments may still be necessary.

Unfortunately a lot of the players here, whether district employees/retirees or taxpayers, don't seem to get that. They want their way, no matter what. But unless they grow up, the results of people's efforts are going to be disappointing. Frankly, I'd like to see the school board give the teachers a target amount to cut, and then tell THEM to submit a balanced budget. They should be the ones to distinguish what is essential from what is expendable. But some things will have to go.

Vigilandy- Did you only read half my post or what? I, like you, have my parents to thank as well as the great teachers I did have. I do realize what came from where. I also realize what didn't come from where it should have. I was pretty specific about the fact that I did have some great teachers throughout school. I also had a lot of very bad teachers. I don't care if you don't agree with my observations, that doesn't make them any less true. Every instance I listed was something I personally witnessed in the 13 years I spent in the Janesville School District. I never criticized a teacher while I was in school. I went to class and did what I was supposed to do. You seem to have assumed I was some disrespectful punk. You'd be wrong. You're also detecting bitterness where there is none. Criticism does not equate to bitterness. I'm not sure what you mean about I "should have been more involved in my kid's education" I don't have kids. I think perhaps you misunderstood my post. I got where I am with the help of my parents and some good teachers. I'm well aware of that. Luckily I was the kind of kid that was capable, with a strong support system at home, and didn't need a lot of extra help. The kids not lucky enough to have those things are the ones that don't make it because of the deficiencies in our school system. I stand by my opinion that the good teachers should be rewarded well for their performance, and the bad teachers should be out the door. Any system that allows teachers like some of the ones I had continue to teach is inherently broken. (and for the record, it wasn't THAT long ago)

How about if somebody like Bill has 12 kids then you need to pay a bit more. Somebody that doesn't have any would pay less.
This example works when talking about collecting more fees.

So these residents saying "raise our taxes" are retired living on pensions funded by tax money ? Enough said.

RichE95 at 9:56 pm 1-27:" "Tax to the Max" will ultimately reduce revenue to both the schools and local government. Property values will further erode. More people will leave Janesville and state support will decrease in response..."
This very accurate summation is a stumbling block for the left leaning democrat.
It appears that those 'residents' attending the meeting had a vested interest in increased tax revenue.
Reducing taxation leads to increased revenue, it's is a proven formula. You can look it up!
Through either a lack of math skills, a lack of comprehension, or willful ignorance many people ignore this simple truth.
That would, it appears, apply to some members of the School Board.

Do these union teachers and employees see whats happening in Egypt today. Thats where we are headed. The government has pitted people against each other and we are headed for a major confrontation between those with union backing and those without. As well as those with $$ and those without. The politicians will stand on the side ad watch. They have stirred the pot, caused the problem through over regulation and now will just watch.

I made sure that I bought my home in the Milton School district just for this reason, poor quality of education in Janesville...I would rather and if forced would send my children to private school before I put them in this district...it is the pits...PERIOD

Its sad that we can not get a balanced budget for our children...then of course the Gazette and their irresponsible journalism makes claims that its okay to raise the taxes, no doubt from the paultry 186 responce survey they put on the web. I say why are we not working harder to maintain a budget that can actually be realized. We constantly wish to take away from the student body and I believe its the administration whom should be the ones held accountable. Why can you not live within your means, if a price goes up look for a better price we do it in business all the time, if they want a raise what have they done to earn that raise, have we climbed in the quality of education? Are we ranked higher are the test results better, if the answer is No then it needs to be the responsibility of the educator(s)..that would mean no RAISE...to hell with the stupid unions, get improved education, for the dollars they want, without cuts, I say send them back to the tables, this is ridiculous, no cuts no new money make it work and that means it comes from the educators end...work on it people if you cannt figure this out then how can you teach our kids

Wow, two retired liberals, I mean, social workers (redundant, I know) can't wait to pay more taxes and they somehow speak for the rest of the taxpayers? Well, as a non liberal and a taxpayer let me be the first to say no more. I have had it with these school boards continuing to reach into my pocket "for the children". Tell you what folks, I gave at the office, and then some. If some jobs have to be eliminated, so be it, it's called reality, the private sector has been dealing with this reality for a couple years now.

Don't like being laid off? Thank Jim Reif and "Tax to the Max" Parr. What do you think of your union leadership now?

Li713-Somehow, despite you realizing it, you must have learned enough and done just enough to get into UW-Madison. Those “bad” teachers must not have taught you a thing, huh? It seems that you might have gone to school in Janesville a while ago. So did I. I also graduated and went on to get my four year degree in college. I do not agree with your observation about teachers. Many stayed late to give me help that I needed. My teachers inspired me to go to college and value my education. I do not think that even if I didn’t like a teacher that it was my place to criticize them, because my parents taught me to respect people in authority. It sounds like you thought you were an angel in school. Your bitterness belies your motivation to publicly criticize the people that gave you the skills to get to college, and be successful in life. My parents were involved with my education, and that helped as well. My kid is now going through Janesville schools, and whenever there is an issue with him, I hear about it. Maybe you should have been more involved with your own kid’s education, and maybe you would have realized there was a problem and brought it to someone’s attention. You should be like me; grateful for how much the teachers cared and put up with me while I grew up, because I, unlike you, was not perfect…Thank you to all my teachers in the School District of Janesville!

"Initiate a 1/2% city tax, and quit taxing only the property owners"
THE PROBLEM with this logic is that, in the end, we will have high sales AND high property taxes!!!

I have no problem paying more in property taxes IF, AND ONLY IF, those that manage the money can prove where all the money goes AND provide the quality education that is overdue.

Let me get this right.When the teachers received their raises they realized some teachers would lose their jobs ? fair enough. Good bye greedy ones.
Initiate a 1/2% city tax, and quit taxing only the property owners. Everyone must contribute, or elimate the $$$'s from the expenses.
Thank you Peggy Sheridan

It would be much better for me if everyone else would get larger houses.

tj57-My answer was "I need a smaller house" not "get a smaller house" as you quoted me.

GaryPrimer was asking a rhetorical question and I gave him a possible answer to his specific question of "what more can I say"

I was never making any statement on what the people of Janesville should do.

greatplain
"When did the idea of services without payment come about?"
dear, mr/ms greatplain; the thing you and all your "lib" buddies fail to understand is that WE do not want or NEED your "services" ANYMORE!!!!

NCC1701 - No, I am not married to Mike Sheridan. Not sure why that matters, but there is the answer to your question.

Peggy Sheridan

tjncj,
If the answer is "get a smaller house" then we are in real trouble. What happens when large numbers of people start leaving WI or Janesville due to heavy tax burden? Those of us who pay 2 to 3 times the average are carrying this community's burden like it or not. What do you think happens if we leave? If you want us to leave we will, and we will take our money with us. You want your property tax bill then? So please continue with that tired old argument.

Greyprimer - you live in a $400,000 home and you want us to pity your poverty? Kind of like griping about gas prices while driving a Hummer. Perhaps is isn't just the schools that need to cut back.....

glock21sf: Really...."taxed out of your home"? See my earlier post please. Double check your taxes. How much have they REALLY gone up in the past two years? Be honest please!

More money does not equal better education

Mavrik: I second that nomination.
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As a product of the Janesville School District I can attest to the fact that the number of poor teachers far outweighs the number of great teachers. I attended Janesville Schools from Kindergarten through 12th grade. I graduated and went on to earn a degree from UW Madison. I was not a trouble maker. I did not have attendance problems. I did well in school. I also chose to graduate a semester early to get out of the district. I had a guidance counselor that told me when I applied to UW Madison that I would never get in. What kind of guidance is that? When I told her I had gotten in, her response was "Are you sure? You weren't waitlisted?" I had no help with scholarships. I had teachers that were immature (but not young), petty, distracted, creepy, down right mean, too busy engaging in their own affairs (literally. affairs with other married teachers), who played favorites, who openly labeled students, who smoked in their office, who on more than one occasion appeared to have been drinking before class, who engaged inappropriately with students, who never at any point showed any interest in actually educating, or who were just plain too busy with their own lives to care to try. Whether any of those teachers are still in the district, I can't say for sure. Half the time the teachers were more like children than the students. Anyone that thinks that people are moving to Janesville for the school system is probably in need of some sort of rehab program. If you want to compare the district to the inner city school systems, then yes, it is probably better. Just look at the test scores. Look at the graduation rates. The overall performance of this district is nothing to be proud of at this point. I went all through school with a boy who was dyslexic, and no one noticed until he reached high school. He did not graduate. I firmly believe it needs major work, but as long as the union protects teachers that have no business being in a classroom its never going to get better. Judge the teachers based on merit. If you're doing your job well, you have nothing to worry about. In my opinion, any good teacher that supports a system that protects bad teachers should be placed on the bad list as well.
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I'd like to be able to say that I had at least one really great teacher every year, but I can't. I did have some really great teachers during my time in the Janesville School District, and I hope those teachers are paid based on merit. Those teachers have truly earned it, and I would gladly pay more in taxes to keep them. The problem is we can't pick and choose.

garyprimer-how about "I need a smaller house"

My property taxes are approaching $10,000 per year.
What more do I have to say?

so people like me should be taxed out of their homes??????? There has to be another way, we are already one of the highest taxed states in the country!!!!!!!!! leave my $$$$ alone!

I applaud Peggy Sheridan's courage for speaking up. We still have some pretty tough times in Janesville for a lot of our residents. I doubt that anyone who is unemployed or underemployed will ask for a tax increase. Senior citizens who didn't get a Social Security increase this year aren't asking for higher expenses. Employed friends and neighbors who are living with frozen wages, unpaid furloughs and reduced or eliminated benefits don't want higher taxes. Our struggling small businesses don't need new expenses. Taxing to the max isn't the answer, but that mentality is part of the problem. We all want the best for our kids but we're going to have to be realistic about what we can collectively afford.

First off I am an unemployed homeowner. With that said, raise taxes to support schools - please. I would rather pay a bit extra and retain (or god forbid increase) the quality of education in the community I live in. With excellent schools comes more home value. I would rather skip a meal out and pay extra in taxes than watch the quality of education decline. I do not have children in the district either.
In terms of cuts why not examine sports? Better yet, the numerous charter schools in the district. Are they all necessary (possibly) or could some be combined? Also, why not examine the rent on those spaces. It seems as though paying rent for charter schools is a luxury. I do not deny the benefit to these programs, however, why not hold them in a district building - possibly a portable classroom?
I understand why some in the community balk at the idea of raising taxes, it sucks. Cutting teachers, social workers, and APs, however, in lieu of raising taxes seems short sighted. These are the people making sure our community's children are becoming reasonable and educated adults. Perhaps I would understand better if I sold cell phones for a living? Never underestimate the amount one can learn about educational administration while peddling an i-phone.

If taxes were fair to all and all had to pay their share you wouldn't have to raise taxes and if spending was under control you could probably lower taxes.

If those citizens want their taxes raised that is their option. I already pay an exuberant amount in taxes and do NOT want to pay anymore!

Don't let a few dictate to the rest of us the monies which would come out of our savings to cover the tax hike that they propose!

The money collected is never enough for the schools! They find ways to spend and create deficits yearly.

Leave my wallet alone! Leave the wallets of those currently unemployed or trying to make ends-meet ALONE!

I cant afford property taxes increases.When I went to school, we didnt have air conditioning.So shut off the air and lower the thermastat. This replacing roofs every 5 yrs is ridicouluse !!Property owners do NOT have deep pockets.People are moving out of Janesville in case you havent noticed.

Mr Reif, you say Janesville economy is on the “upswing”. Let’s examine the FACTs from the US department of labor, Bureau of labor statistics (here is the link so you can see for yourself (http://data.bls.gov/pdq/SurveyOutputServ...) The average annual unemployment rate between 2000-2008 was 5.58% with 2008 being the highest at 6.1%. Since then Janesville has reached as high as 13.2%, the most current month (Nov 2010) is predicted at 9.4%, the year previous to that (Nov 2009) 11.4%. So YES the economy is on the upswing, HOWEVER Janesville has NOT recovered. NOW is not the time to talk about more spending, NOW is the time to learn from our mistakes, make GOOD decisions with the current budget. I wish we could afford to all the best things in life for our children, but the obvious truth is WE CAN NOT. Time to make very tough decisions on NEEDS AND WANTS. Keep the “needs”, reduce/ cut the “wants”. Very basic financial and life skills I have been teaching my daughter for 17 years.

"Irresponsible headline, Frank Schultz and Scott Angus! A few people who attended one meeting and stand to benefit at the expense of others do not constitute the "residents" of this city. Shame on you for the misleading journalism." - thank you troublemaker for stating this. Is this reporter coming from a position of bias, possibly ?

You know what folks. If you don't want your taxes raised, go to the next meeting and be heard. Otherwise mark my words Lori Stottler just can't wait to raise them by at least 10 percent. She wanted this the last go around to.

billnewbie's comment seems right on to me....

"Marginal teachers are protected by their contract from dismissal. Even poor teachers are difficult to remove if those teachers have been in the district long enough"

Interesting comment. Do you think that may be the reason the 18+ administrators have either left the district or been forced to leave the district since the beginning of the Studer / Schulte Era?

I wonder if the building administrators are as fed up with the "Journey to Excellence" nonsense as we are & the uselessness of the HML conversations that started this month.

The teachers are all laughing at their principals behind their backs - knowing that they are protected (if they have enough seniority) by the union. Conversations are taking place everyday over lunch about who is a High, Mid, and Low performer in the building.

I can understand why the tax payers are fed up when they see no accountability among the teachers.

I am looking to leave this district and or this profession. I've had enough!!

Don't climb on Peggy Sheridan. She actually stood up for the tax payers. Murray however appears to be a different story. I applaud board members who actually understand that our property taxes are already ridiculous and now the teachers union advises them to tax more? It will never be enough folks. They will always want more.

lovetoscrap why would I want to rent, love owning my own home, nobody to tell me what color to paint, it gets fixed when it needs to you still pay property taxes when you rent, it is figured in your rent payment. Homeschooling NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If there are people out there that want to pay more in taxes, let them pay mine as well. There is no reason to raise the taxes. People are suriving on less, making their personal budgets work, thats what the schools need to do as well. This will surely discourage people from moving to the area, will depress property values (people do look at taxes before buying), and it figured into monthly expenditures.

Parents seem to send their kids to school like its daycare, they are not involved and now some what to pay more. Go ahead...... pick up the tab for others as well then.

glock21sf
You might win the ignorant comment of the day. My total tax bill went up $2.06 in 2009 and about $20 in 2010.
Double check your facts before complaining.

Finally someone willing to chip in for the future of our society. Taxes are the price of civilization.

When did the idea of services without payment come about? Our right wing philosophers have created a world where supposedly, government doesn't do anything right, you borrow, so don't pay taxes, let things fail and privatize it. So, people don't think that their taxes should ever go up.
Set aside politics and realize unified services are cheaper and work better than many private systems.

To the school board, raise my school taxes, keep the teachers, then pull your heads out of you collective ***** and start managing your budget.

Star Trek boy - Let me educatate (sic) you right now there is (sic) about 25,000 people still unemployed in Janesville.

Your post shows why we need math and English teachers. 15 spelling/grammatical errors in a paragraph and math that is so far off it is comical.

who can tell us exactly when the last time SCHOOL taxes went up?

Whew! For just one second I thought the board and comunity might talk about freezing or even cutting back on the $100k+ health retirement benefits that employees of the district get.

Instead, there's talk about raising taxes on everyone else who doesn't get benefits like that, which is only fair.

Does the Gazette seriously think we want our taxes raised? Are they Nuts? Asking such a foolish question based on the opinion of a couple of retired counselors and a couple of teachers is absurd. ATTENTION SCHOOL BOARD. I have polled my family and 17 of us DO NOT want our taxes raised. The 2 counselors, the 2 teachers and Their families have just been out voted. Don't even think about raising taxes.

fbcoach would obviously benefit from this increase in taxation. It's just amazing--whenever there is a union involved it seems a financial mess is sure to follow. Outside of a tax increase, do whatever it takes to balance the budget. Taxpayers are already expected to shoulder too much of a burden. Increase the registration costs, renegotiate the teachers' contract, let go of some of the teachers and deal with the increased class sizes. I look at the increased class sizes as a non-issue. These parents that are crying about their kids education being compromised--take the initiative--pick up a book and get involved with your child's education. Don't push it all off on the public sector......

Rent and homeschool. :)

fbcoach66,
"It is the under taxing for 5 years that put us in this hole not the teachers."
wow! i never thought of it like that before,you mean ALL we have to do is pay MORE taxes and everything will be all better..HONEY, quick grab the checkbook...

Between this and now paying for an ME, it's about time to get outta dodge. Tax all you want, I'll be gone soon enough. But here's an idea, tax the people that actually have children in schools more. Give them an increase and jack up the athletic fees. Those that think their kids are going to be the next Jordan can foot the bill for it. Time to flush a good chunk of the boards too. Murray and Podzilni are good ways to start.

I'd like to see the annual report for 2010 and the proposed budget...bet I could come up with something reasonable for cuts.

Yeah right! Give me a break! No one in their right mind wants to pay more taxes!!!

The most ridiculous post I have read for the month.

"We are in this mess because we did not tax to the max."

I'm just going to go bang my head against the wall in honor of that stupidity.

I am so glad I moved out of Janesville and Wisconsin all together. It's been a relief to get away from the taxes they imposed on residents there. (Smiling all the way to the bank with the money I'm saving)

well why don't they just tax the ones that want to get get taxed, they can foot the bill, better yet Janesville will just hold a last second hearing without community input and tax us all even more that we already pay!!

lets get rid of all the stuff that the city doesnt need to spend money on. that would save a bunch of money. another thing i have 3 kids in the school district and lets have ALL of the teachers actually teach the kids what they are supposed to do. if they dont then they should be fired! not the ones that actually do teach!

Poor headline to plaster across the front page Gazette. It'd be more accurate to say "(small number of vested interest) Residents: Raise Taxes".
The broader community would certainly say NO WAY!

Pay attention to the upcoming election Janesville. Mr. Sodemann successfully balances the taxpayers burden with the school system's needs. Mr. Murray consistently gives the union what they want. If he wouldn't have given the figurative farm away in over-the-top and unaffordable benefits in the last contract, money would be available to minimize inevitable cuts.

fbcoach66 just doesn't get it.

More money does not insure a better education. Private schools and foreign countries are doing much better for a fraction of the cost. We are not being out spent. We are being out worked. The tax base has been eroded by lazy arrogant government employees crushing the private sector with rules and taxes. Remember the term "Public Servant"? It has been replaced by "MORE, give us MORE". Frankly, people are tapped out and we can't afford so many people trying to help us at one time. If I could make one suggestion it would be to raise taxes on only public employees to make up the money. After all "40% of our kids are living in poverty" and not one of them is a teachers kid.

what ever happened to Just say NO

A caller to WCLO today correctly pointed out the economic ignorance of Mr Reif and some school board members. "Tax to the Max" will ultimately reduce revenue to both the schools and local government. Property values will further erode. More people will leave Janesville and state support will decrease in response. Additonally, small business will not stay in Janesville. The loss of even more business will reduce local wealth and tax receipts. Janesville is on the verge of declaring itself "Closed for Business". Once again, just like the UAW, some of us choose to believe money falls from the sky without consequence.

Jim Reif: Wow! He has some balls. Not sure where you are at but I have not personally seen anything form this "upswing" he's talking about. The people have no more to give.

http://thegroveevansvillewi.blogspot.com...

The break down for the average house is $112 per year, which contains 1.6 adults, so $112/1.6/52 weeks is $1.35 per WEEK or as I said on the other story, just one less soda a week!!!
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I believe the $3 million is over the 4 years of the contract so its only $750,000 of the $10 million.
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Glock; you seem to think you don't use our schools services. Where did you doctor learn basic biology? Where did your wife's favorite chef get inspired to cook? Where did the contractor or plumber first turn a wrench? Where did the firefighter learn about CPR? Obviously not all in school, but the VAST majority either were first inspired or encouraged right here in the Janesville schools!
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Some of the school board members see the light. People are moving to and staying in Janesville because of the schools. If we don't have strong schools people will take their children elsewhere which will lead to less state aid, to weaker schools, to less people to less state aid...etc. etc. etc
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NOW is the time to stop the downward spiral caused by not funding our schools. BTW did you know that everytime we leave a $1 million untapped the state cuts our aid by roughly $300,000 the next year. It is the under taxing for 5 years that put us in this hole not the teachers.

"Residents: Raise our taxes"

Puh-leez. That's as ridiculous as the idea of firing 120 teachers. What this community needs is some critical thinking skills.

Everyone is so upset, heck let's just have a fund raiser. Geez. I find it really sad that 40 percent of our kids are living in poverty. What is happening in this world? Not just here, but all over. I know, let's send all our kids to China for an education then give them the option to stay there or come back to this sorry country!

The sense of entitlement the teachers and employees of the school district have here is impressive. During the last teacher's union contract negotiations when it was pointed out to them that their demands were unreasonable because our community is in a deep recession, their boilerplate response was always that when times were good they didn't get the large raises they are certain they were entitled to then so they should get raises now even if some people in the district are hurt by it. After all, recession or not, the teachers deserve much more than they are asking for let alone what they were about to get, according to them. In the meantime, no concessions were given towards accountability for our teachers. Marginal teachers are protected by their contract from dismissal. Even poor teachers are difficult to remove if those teachers have been in the district long enough.

So now some folks want to throw yet more money at our schools. It's been said that insanity is doing the same things over and over again and expecting different results. We've raised salaries across the board for school system employees every year, year in year out. Our district spending per pupil is continually growing year after year. Yet the results we get from our public schools is stagnant at best after decades of declining achievement coupled with decades of increased spending. Spending more and more money year after year ain't workin' folks.

Let's try to remember, the primary focus of our school district is to educate our students. Some folks seem to think the primary focus of our school district is to provide as many well paying jobs as it can.

My problem with the raise in the taxes is: It's just a raise in how much people can waste in their budgets. When I was in school 5 years ago I heard multiple teachers say at the end of the year " If I don't spend all of my budget they will reduce it instead of seeing that I need more." And that is why this whole country is going broke.

Budgeting. If I have a business with x number of employees and they have been getting 1-2% raises on average every year, then I would have to set aside money for that 1-2% raise for future budgets. If my employees accepted a 0% raise one year and then got a 1-2% raise the next year there should be money in the budget for the second year and then some, correct? So what you are saying bill, is that even though the teachers took a 0% raise for a year you still have a 3 million budget shortfall that you are blaming on the teachers? What happen to the money you budgeted for the year they accepted 0%. Whats that? You spent it somewhere elese. You are correct that is the teachers fault. Did you say cost have been increasing and you didn't do anything to bring in more income to cover the cost? Teachers fault.

li713,
I never said teachers shouldn't be cut. I said teaching staff should be directly correlated to the number of students in the district. Obviously if enrollment is dropping so should the teaching staff and administrators. What I do not agree with is the fact that the school board president is blaming the shortfall on the teachers recent contract settlement and therefore wants to cut teachers to make up the difference. If he said he needed to cut teachers due to enrollment drops I would completely agree but that is not the case. Also never did he mention that the school board has not taxed as it could have in the past and that is the main reason they have such a deficit. It is due to poor fiscal responsibilty and money management of the board that is the problem here.
Mr. Schultz please do an article on how the school funding system is directly correlated to local taxing. The less you tax the less you get from the state.

Irresponsible headline, Frank Schultz and Scott Angus! A few people who attended one meeting and stand to benefit at the expense of others do not constitute the "residents" of this city. Shame on you for the misleading journalism.

glock21st, really about the sidewalks. all that b about them, the runners that run in the streets that have them, tell ur homeloan provider, then insurance company, about the city plans. then use ur vote, based on the insurance company and hl providers support for the local candidates proposals...vote when u can.those folks don't want the liability of the sidewalks , neither does the city

What is the max percentage that taxes can be raised again? Based on that figure, what would be the maximum increase in taxes per $100,000 in assessed property value (I think that's how it's broken down)? Those stats might make be helpful to know and might soften the blow for taxpayers.

I am so sick of our property taxes going up to pay for our schools!!!!!! My wife and I have no children, by our own choice, and have been just about forced to sell our home which we have owned for only 10 years (our first home) because of the ever rising taxes! Here is an idea, lets increase the taxes of all the EMPLOYEES and SPOUSES who were in favor of raising my taxes! Maybe increase the taxes of those who actually have kids in the school system! If my property taxes go up any more I will be forced to sell my house, lose my dogs in order to rent an apt. It's bad enough I live under the specter of having the "sidewalk police" tell me any day that I will have to pay more taxes to put in a sidewalk!!!!!

how many assistants for each ESC staff? How does most of this community adjust for lower wages , after being unemployed. Lower home values, but not assessment? Bubble burst, but the property tax payer is to pay more? To make this work, all, including city and school must take cuts. WE all have! It is moreover worse than 1981 -1985. Our grown kids have to do with less, we as adults have to do with less, and children have to do with less. So does the city, schools, countys, state, and feds. It will be painfull!! It is painfull! Too many takers!! Entitlements have to go. Summertime college kids mowing lawns? put taxpayers in those roles. They will problabley rake leaves and shovel snow for less! Colledge kids can work as summer roofers and gruntwork, some older adults cannot. but they think its too Hard!

'Here's an idea. If you have kids in school, you pay to educate them, not me. It's not my responsibility. And if you can't afford to educate your kids, stop having them'

ignorant post of the day

If you're going to go around saying anyone doesn't care about the quality of education, I'd take into consideration the fact that the teachers union still demanded and agreed to a contract containing $3 million in pay increases in a recession, during a time of declining enrollment, when a good portion of the community is unemployed and/or living in poverty, and (or at least I would hope) knowing that the school board already had to borrow from the reserve funds to cover the budget for this year(because I refuse to believe they were too stupid to see this coming). Maybe the union should educate themselves on the fact that, incredibly enough, money does not grow on trees.

"I would be interested to know how many teachers $3 million would buy"
answer; TOO many..

Realist: Are you trying to say that the teachers couldn't figure out that $3 million in raises was going to mean they would have to cut teachers? If they are really that stupid/ignorant/out of touch with their community and employer, then perhaps these people shouldn't be educating our youth to begin with.
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I would be interested to know how many teachers $3 million would buy. Obviously its not the entirety of the deficit, but its 30%. I'd say that is significant. No matter how you try to twist it, the teachers hold 30% of the blame.

Remember the teachers did take a pay freeze for a portion of the 4 year contract. You cannot tell me, anyone in their right mind would take a pay freeze for a four year contract. Even if they would have, do you honestly think the district would not be laying off teachers? The "pay raise" for the teachers does not even come close to the amount of money the district is short. But please continue to blame the teachers for the deficit. Yes I do believe some programs that are wasteful should be cut and yes I do believe the amount of teachers should relate directly to enrollement. But that is not what is happening. Billy says they are cutting teachers to make up money.
"Board President Bill Sodemann said part of the budget problem is the raises teachers got in the recent contract. The board knew they would have to cut teachers in order to pay for those raises, Sodemann said."
Obviously doesn't care about the quality of education. If he did he would look at getting rid of the charter schools and the ESC. If there is such a shortage of kids there should be plenty of room in the buildings for these programs and the ESC staff. Will that make up 10 mil? Of course not, but it may save a few teachers and keep class sizes down some.

what the gazette does not print is the "residents"
they are speaking of are either direct EMPLOYEES or their spouse works FOR district or city govt.
sure they'll pay more taxes with YOUR tax money...

Here's an idea. If you have kids in school, you pay to educate them, not me. It's not my responsibility. And if you can't afford to educate your kids, stop having them.

oops, follow

also our teachers are not there to babysit for parents that don't parent. kids need home structure and routine to mold them into responsible adults. it starts @ home! there are more responsible parents out there working 2 jobs, if they can find a second one, and their job @ home. both my children are out of HS, and @ tech school. I am grateful that they stayed to the basics, excell in class, sports if you can, but the education is their responsibility to learn to compete as an adult. feed them , lead them and they will fillow

I get real sick of these articles. I have to budget with less money than before in these times. I think they should start doing it too.I commented on the other article and am not going to repeat myself again.

we have reduced enrollment, so it should equal reduced staff. we also did all the expansions based on numbers before the finacial meltdown. I voted against the expansions, as was leary of unsupported home values, GM(2006)buyout, which was the beginning of the end for the janesville plant. Our leaders then only spent as if a limitless credit card with a taxpayer forgiveness clause was in place. Any taxpayer(property) that is informed that the janesville high schools are overloaded with many students that do not attend and effect enrollment. Teachers get paid whether the student is there or not. if we base the need for teachers on attendance of students, maybe they will be grateful for the job they are paid to do. too bad the civil liberties washed over to the teachers to have some discipline over the students many years ago. the costs are amok with waste like our governments...get back to the basics..teachers teach, not whine. Students attend and learn, those that don't attend are out and on there own

another reason teachers may not have gotten as much of a raise compared to others in the state is the cost of living is much lower here than other cities.

Teachers have to take some of the blame themselves. While most people have not gotten raises, or have taken pay cuts, over the past few years, the teachers still demand a raise. Well teachers, you got it! And now, you will loose even MORE positions! Your union has done you a disservice this time. I hope your raise was worth it! We really need to find a way to reward the good teachers based on performance and not seniority.

wheres raf to tell them they can pay extra tax if they want to??

Reif needs to get a clue. Just because the teachers got less than other districts in the state doesn't mean they did their part by taking a raise. Rock county has one of the highest, if not the highest unemployment in the state. Someone in the article said the poverty rate in the district is 40%. I'm not sure if that's accurate, but if its even close, that's exceptionally high. These teachers need to make an appointment with reality. If teachers want a raise, they should go apply for a job in a district that's giving raises. Comparing Rock County and the Janesville area to other parts of the state is not apples to apples. Our school district has a $10 million dollar budget shortfall. To say that the economy is on the upswing so taxpayers should foot the bill for it is just plain ignorant. It sounds like everyone knew going into it that those raises were going to cost the district teachers. If everyone was ok with that when the agreement was made, then they need to shut up and take it now. What kind of bait and switch is this that the teachers are crying now about cuts. WHERE DID YOU THINK THAT $3 MILLION WAS GOING TO COME FROM? Don't play the victim now. Decline the raises now and I'll support an increase on my taxes. $10 million minus the $3 million for raises is $7 million. Increase the taxes and subtract another $4.4 million, that leave $2.6 million in cuts. Start at the top.

Anyone that wants their' taxes raised can pay for the ones that cannot afford it at this time; of which there are many.

Nice headline, trying to stir the pot I guess to sell some papers.

Rooster,
So sad you left, you obviously don't pay attention to your tax bill. Why don't you review them from previous years and calculate how much the school portion went up. I think you may have a different tune.

go ahead janesville, raise all the taxes you want. after being a janesville resident for forty years. i was blessed lately to be able to get the heck out of a town that shows no responsibility to its taxpayers; the school board being the most selfish in their vision and spending.