jvldss, perhaps you have some infallible method of determining when a public place that families frequent is going to come under attack by robbers or a nut case. Perhaps your definition of "public place that families frequent" doesn't include McDonalds restaurants or public parks.

I'm 56 years old and have needed a gun once, walking home from work, just 2 blocks from my home in a residential neighborhood (something that fits MY definition of "a public place that families frequent"). I will prefer to have a gun in case I need one, rather than to need a gun because I preferred not to carry one.

So the reasonable man is willing to pull a gun in self defense and open fire on the criminals who frequent these public places? How is jeopardizing others ever reasonable. If you like guns or feel the need to carry one, fine, that is your right now. But for me, I would prefer to steer my family clear of such situations. In my 60 years I have never had the need for a gun. Maybe I'm just the lucky one.

jvldss, the reason responsible people want the right to carry a weapon to a public place that families frequent is that irresponsible, criminal and crazy people already do so. Sometimes saying "Please don't hurt me" and handing over your wallet and cell phone isn't enough:

Killeen, Texas - Luby's cafeteria
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luby%27s_ma...

San Ysidro, California - McDonalds
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Ysidro_...

Palatine, Illinois - Brown's Chicken
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown%27s_C...

Milwaukee, Wisconsin - South Shore Park
http://www.wisn.com/news/9311570/detail....

I would be more inclined to shop with my family in a store that promoted "No Weapons Allowed", immunity or not. I understand it is a constitutional right and all the arguments on either side of the issue but I still see no reason for any responsible citizen to carry a weapon to a public place that families frequent.

We shall see. If I am wrong I guess I won't collect my bet, but I'm pretty confident I will collect..

justmy414: Your suicide theory is sooo far off base ......please enlighten all of us people on how concealed carry will give the huge number of suicidal people more opportunity ? that statement is ridiculous !.....Responsible gun owners keep their firearms secured when either not on them or not home with them .

And I say we will soon be seeing reports of accidental discharges in public places, like the one in the mall Nov 2. We will also see reports of kids finding and using parents guns in cars. We will also be seeing reports of people committing suicide by gun. These individuals might have tried to commit suicide regardless of concealed carry, but since they will now have easier access to guns, more of them will be successful at killing themselves, and fewer will be saved from a suicide attempt. I do have to say, that republicans are working hard to decrease the labor force, so the remaining individuals who are left alive might have a better chance of getting one of the seasonal minimum wage jobs Walker keeps promoting.

justmy414, I said crimes will change from forcible theft of property from victims to property theft from premises, and we will see a few more publicized instances of crimes being foiled.

At least battered women will have the option of getting a permit to defend themselves against crazy men. No more having to trust to luck or relying on a hat pin or pepper spray or a lucky kick to the family jewels. Now molesters will have to worry about their privates being instantly moved across the parking lot by a woman with an effective means of self-defense.

The Castle Doctrine is going to get some teenagers boyfriend killed sneaking in the window at night. Present self-defense was already sufficient to protect battered women who fought back. The more likely senario is a battered woman has the gun but cannot bring herself to use it, gets overpowered by the man and then killed with her own gun. I like the way janesvillecomments is already conceeding we won't see crime reducing. We won't, it will increase, as will accidental and bystander injuries and killings.

@TJ: You said "Whether someone carries a gun into a business or out in public, eventually it will lead to a tragedy. I asked myself why would anyone want to carry a gun around? To appear in control, macho, elite, powerful, a law enforcement-cowboy-mercenary want-to be. I think those that do carry are already off center".
What does any of this have to do with concealed carry? Criminals already have CC. Those that are "off center" already have CC. This is about giving normal law-abiding citizens the opportunity (not the obligation) to defend themselves. Think of it as gun registration if that makes it more understandable to you. But again...criminals don't register their guns. Those that are "off center" don't register their guns. So by definition, CC only applies to those who follow the law. Why is this concept so difficult for some people?

I also Believe that the Castle Doctrine Law may help in Severe Domestic type cases where one party is "stalking" the other Breaks into the home is on a restraining order . Goes Hand in Hand with Concealed Carry . If it Stops one woman from Being beaten , killed, or raped in their own home or any where for that matter the Law will be worth its weight in gold !

gwendt, Barack Obama started the wildfire sales on guns the day he beat Billary in the Presidential primary. It was about a year before area gun shops got back to being able to stock firearms and sell them at the normal speed they did before Obama's rise to the top. It took ammunition longer, and permanently boosted the price of ammo and reloading components. The Republicans didn't have to do anything except lose the election.

I'm hoping Walker's election to the Presidency will cause enough of a slump in firearms sales to drive ammo prices down to where they were before Obama ran for the office. ☺

SarahB1, you won't SEE it preventing a lot of crime, because the greatest effect the law will have is to quietly convince some career muggers and robbers to switch from mugging and robbing for income to committing burglary for money.

You will see a few more reported incidents where a law-abiding citizen has prevented a murder, assault, or rape because they had a handgun with them where they wouldn't have legally been able to before.

justmy414, you mean the train system that would have very few riders and may cost more one way than it would be to just drive to the destination. And the yearly up keep would be in the millions. Wisconsin citizens love to drive to where they want to go to.

Yes, I know, just rename greedy corporations, job creaters and all is well. That theory hasn't worked in 30 years. The stimilus didn't fail, it prevented a drop into depression and as of 1/2/2011 less than 1/2 of the funds had acually been spent. Wisconsin would have had a nice drop in unemployment if idiot Walker hadn't turned back 3/4 of a billion dollars.

justmy414, corporate greed and profit seeking? Let's see here, failed stimulises (sp?), will increase everyone's taxes, new mandates and regulations every month will make businesses think about hiring full time people. Profit seeking, that is what businesses do to stay in business, the way you want for profit seeking, is called socialism and government ownership.

Oh, and gang members and other criminals already have that mentality.

TJRockCounty, are you referring about those who are criminals?, ones that never have been around firearms?, or the ones that know and have been around firearms? I will carry at times, but I will NOT be one of those stereotypes that you are trying to push upon us, IMO.

I was against concealed carry from the start. Whether someone carries a gun into a business or out in public, eventually it will lead to a tragedy. I asked myself why would anyone want to carry a gun around? To appear in control, macho, elite, powerful, a law enforcement-cowboy-mercenary want-to be. I think those that do carry are already off center. Great!

Sorry, that is the way of the world in Fitzwalkerstan, compassion, concern for others, and warm hearts have been outlawed. Corporate greed, profit seeking and influence pedaling are all that matters now.

justmy414, I don't know the details, but there was a death this week in Rock County by oneself after cc became law. How do you want to collect on that bet? I know that was cold, but it is reality and he/you are very cold to even place that kind of bet! My family had a victim of a suicide many years and to even publish such a thought was very wrong of you.

@Gandalf: OMG you've got to be kidding LOL! I looked at your link, it cited 385 total deaths caused by CC holders. 385!! That my friend, in this nation of 300+ million people, is statistically near-zero. That's like one year in Detroit, or DC. Get real! You've just shown that CC holders are waaaaaaaaaay safer than the criminals. Besides, if they were already criminals, the law wouldn't matter, riiiiiiight?????? Duh.

Southridge Mall, off duty officer accidentally discharges gun while waiting for pretzel in food court. Yes, I feel safer already. Good thing I never go to the mall anymore.

Suicide ?.....really ?.....you honestly think some one is actually waiting for the Concealed gun law to go into effect before they off themselves with a pistol ?......you do know suicide is against the law right ? lol....i dont follow peoples logic very well i guess .

Sure, I bet on the "innocent" life being saved. How about January 31, 2020.

WOW 414 so your first 2 guesses include suicide and accidental discharge causing injury. Imagine that suicide something that occurs 600- 700 times a year in WI, then ADCI which no doubt happens every year during dear hunting season, would you like to also place a bet on when the first innocent life will be saved.

Republicans just added another risk to being in business.

I have already placed bets on the timeframe of the first concealed carry incident. By Dec. 31, 2011 a suicide, accidental discharge causing injury, bystander shooting or outright murder will take place. I'm just waiting to collect my money.

Ahhh, the good old VPC quotes and links. This and other pro criminal, anti constitutional groups keep using the flawed studies over and over again. These groups cannot even come up with, or believe the real reason why crime has gone down with ccw or firearm ownership in the once high crime areas, when legal enforcement is lax.

TroubleMaker, we don't hear about concealed carry incidents in other states because the crimes aren't sensationalist enough to be reported on by the media. Check out http://www.vpc.org/ccwkillers.htm

People who say there are no problems with concealed carry either don't know their facts or they so wrapped-up in their ideology that they're blind to the facts that show we are all less safe with concealed carry.

Just like voting, you cast a ballot for who you like , I believe the all mighty dollar speak Volumes to shop owners . sit back and enjoy the show because its Law Now ! Its all over but the crying ,

I wonder about personal liability for those who carry firearms.
It would seem that insurance coverage should be a requirement just as it is with vehicles since both are capable of causing accidental harm and property damage.
I am sure that would be unpopular, but it would certainly be responsible and would demonstrate responsibility on the part of the firearm owner.

The picture of the guy on the front page a few days back says it all.
There is your role model. ;-)

{{{{yawn}}}} Yeah man, I got my pistol & I won't shop in a store that prohibits concealed weapons. Now I'm goin' home to watch reruns of Dukes Of Hazzard. These comments should fit in with the pro gun mentality that I read here.

If this was any kind of real issue we'd be hearing about it in all the other states that allow CC. Non-issue. Next topic.

jvillerdr: Better keep them pesky children all corralled and outta the cross fire, better yet gettem sum kevlar for x-mas it in this year . Meen while i'll do my part by buying non ricocheting cor-bon or glaser safety slug's that should ease you paranoid mind a lil bit .

What the heck is this world coming to?????? The Republicans owning all the firearms companies to iniatiate a gun selling bonanza to spur the market? ala the dotcom boost, etc. thought the leaders main concern was to make President Obama a one-term President ???? Very confusing indeed !!!

I agree, avidreader. Nor did they give parents a choice before they made this the OK corral so that everywhere you go, you now have to worry that some trigger-happy yahoo wanna-be-hero is going to kill or injure your children in the crossfire because someone else took his cash out of his pockets too slowly and they mistook his hand for a weapon. I will be looking for businesses that have a saner policy.

Werner is all double talk. he has no common sense whatever. Why dont you research ourneighbors, Iowa, Mn, Michigan etc and find out how they handle it, how many permits that have issued? You and all the other dogooders just want to scare people.

The signs on the buildings that are against actually say this---> "Attention Criminals, Everyone in this building is unarmed". Awesome for the criminal!!!

All a bunch of B.S. The government didn't give businesses a say in whether they wanted smoking allowed on their property yet here they have a say in whether they allow gun toting. I for one am tired of the government playing both ends of the stick. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

If a retailer has a sign "No Guns" i'll just mosey on to their Competitor who is at least willing to recognize the 2nd amendment . That if i carry a pistol or Not .

Odd Alaska has high suicide rates when its Dark there more than its light.........ohhh that prolly has nothing to do with it........maybe no hand guns should be allowed in towns where Bears Roam Threw town on a regular basis :/

proartist, show us the real facts, not the ones from the anti self protection groups (Brady, CDC, VPC, etc).

What will the Gazette's policy be for their customers and employees? They did endorse the CC law.

We should start making legal everything that criminals do (prostitution, elicit drugs, bribery, extortion, robbery and gun carrying) so us law-abiding citizens won't feel cheated out of any freedoms.

So by your post Hawaii a concealed carry state is safe. Alaska also has big suicide rates is that because of concealed carry. Your argument makes no sense, if any criminal can carry a gun why not a law abiding citizen

Once more, the fact is that all 48 states saw a reduction in crime rates following their adoptions of concealed carry. It's truly amazing the lengths that zealots will go to, in order to overlook or distort evidence like that! On another note, many of us will be making lists of merchants that no longer want our business!

“If you’re doing something negligent, you may be liable,” he said." ... That is NO different than the current law. Removing liability in this law was inserted as an incentive to force allowing guns and, thus, provide environments less conducive to the health and well being of their patrons. Any public place that posts as a "gun free zone" shall have no more liability issues than they did prior to this egregious attempt to appease the NRA over the welfare of the people. Alaska has the highest number of guns per capita and the highest gun deaths. Hawaii the least in both categories. The people of Wisconsin did not want nor need to join the ranks of the other 48 states who are dying with the consequences of bad law.