EZONER, what to you is a decent wage? What is your number for someone who teaches 30 kids to read and write with less and less support?

So do the CEO's make a decent wage or are they under paid?

The problem is your interpretation of a decent wage. Most feel that today -- teachers are over compensated when wages and benefits are considered together. Thats the reality. So if you dont like t he message -- maybe your not willing to listen.

why don't everyone that thinks teachers and union workers give up their money and benefits do the same and then run your mouth in here I am so sick of the negative posts to the ones that are GOOD ENOUGH TO TEACH YOUR CHILDREN BUT NOT GOOD ENOUGH TO EARN A DECENT WAGE and Have Benefits like the rest of you.

Why is it the JEA's fault we are in this financial issue? The school board has mismanaged the tax levy for years and it is our turn to pay up. I have zero kids in Janesville Schools and I am a private worker, but I AGREE that we should share the burden. Raise the tax levy and I will pay my $55 a year towards it instead of raping the teachers pay.

Back in the day, to get a job with good wages in a union shop, you had to "know someone". How many times have I heard the comment, "oh, so and so got Johnny a job at the plant."
Those days are over.
To get a job these days, you don't have to know somebody, you have to know something, i.e. get a good education to get a good job.

Regardless of all the republikants and Walker fans a contract is a contract. Sorry you don't have a union to represent you, but you just keep drinking the republikant koolade i'm sure it will make you richer if you are already rich.
If your not rich just bend over you get yours from the republikants too.

Zoom - You didn't seriously bring Ford into this conversation did you? As you can see, things are changing & we all better get a clue to what a Global Economy is or we're all in more trouble than even the 1930's created for Americans, I don't care if your rich, poor or any where in between. The class warfare has to be put aside & figure out how we're going to survive as a country or whatever your lifestyle is, its going to change drastically - soon

http://www.france24.com/en/20110906-ford...

Yes Unions served a purpose at a time in the early 19th century. Like most things in our house holds have evevoled the "union" has become a detrivtive insvase entity that is not competing anymore.

Do I hire union workers? No Not at all cause they can work slow stall a job, steal, not come into work just cause.

Unions were formed like I said above when there were a need for them plus we did not have a global economic system at the time also were did not have this since of cheapness which is the other side of the sword how am I going to pay some one 30bucks an hour to do something only for that same person to shop at wal-mart

Might as well shoot your self in the foot if you think about that.

I suggest that everyone learn how the econmic system works before they start spouting off that we need unions.

Go to a library and look at trends throughout the course of mankind. You will see how things worked or you might see that everything evolves or it dies LIKE JANESVILLE and UNIONS

Its auto-town mentality I guess, but I cant say that as I would be saying everyone is the same.

The mind is meant to be used not to put shampoo and a hat on it

On Saturday, May 25, 1985, an editorial I wrote to the Editor, the Gazette, went as follows:
As a casual observer of the 1980s, I write this letter and lament the downwall of OSHA, the Occupational Safety and Health Administration. During this administration, OSHA has gone underground, buried by increased defense spending and Star Wars weaponry build-ups.
I have had the misfortune of working for a living in a workplace filled with noise, cigarette smoke, safety hazards, and inept management, not to mention intoxicated or otherwise incapacitated workers at my side.
Are not these abuses reported by workers to their supervisors, who casually ignore their pleas, using the power of hiring and firing to hold recalcitrant employees in line?
Hearing loss, lung cancer, fires, and arguments amont workers and their bosses are preventable hazards in the job environment, namely by the use of ear protection, designated smoking and not-smoking areas, instruction by trained professionals in the proper use of firefighting equipment, and human relations trained management.
Perhaps OSHA will resurface. Its time has come.
Although those were my thoughts 26 years ago, on this labor day, OSHA is alive and well, and improvements are observable everywere I have seen. Do you think those kids making Nike shoes in some shop in some far away country have an OSHA to complain to? Or the Chinese mine workers, do they have a Mine Safety Administration to call upon to vent their safety concerns? I think not.
These days, working in a union shop is a pleasure, and if not a union shop, OSHA keeps those under scrutiny, and although wages may be smaller in comparison, the "supervisors" don't carry whips anymore.
If you are unemployed, review your skill set, and market them to the highest bidder for the services you can render to an employer.
It's the way America works, and if you can find better working accomodations elsewhere, I hear Canada needs workers to cut down trees in the winter to harvest for paper pulp. Bring your warm clothing, they work when it's -40 degrees, which by the way, is the same in the Farenheit scale as it is on the Celsius scale--either way, it's mighty darn cold. Happy Labor Day everybody!!!!

Zoom,I saw the empty whiskey bottles in the rest room and rest areas, the stealing, the cheating, People that would not show up for work for months, the brownies laced with pot. are you saying this did not contribute to the downfall of GM in Janesville?

"Zoom, Did you work there? this downfall started years ago."

Exactly. GM was mismanaged. Too many brands. Too many dealers competing against each other. However, GM Janesville closed because the product they made, though tops in their segment, saw a huge drop in sales, both from record high fuel prices, and the recession.

Remember that Ford had the same Union contracts as GM, yet Ford didn't need the massive bailout that GM received. Blaming the Union for GM's failure is incorrect.

How many teachers have you had in your lifetime?
For myself, I estimate over 50, some with B.S. degrees, some B.A.'s, M.A's and PhD's, including some of the most brilliant men in their fields.
Certainly teachers need compensation for their work, but deep down, they teach because it is their "calling", and something they love doing.
Thank your teachers for turning your ignorance into understanding, that is, the simple minded childlike brain you were given at birth, into a highly capable thinking "machine".
It doesn't matter what your I.Q. was when you were born, but teachers may have added a few points on during your lifetime, let's give them a "thank-you", and trust them that they know whaat they are doing regarding their contract negotiations.

I love the way that the questions are always framed to get us to blame individual workers or groups. How about a question like "Do you agree with the decision to give tax cuts to the rich given that it demanded cuts to the poor, middle class, and to our communities?"

Zoom, Did you work there? this downfall started years ago. Then when the truck line shut down and went to Flint it really hurt.

oldtimer, GM closed the Janesville plant because they happened to build ginormous SUV's when gas hit $4+/gallon, and total annual vehicle sales dropped 30%. GM Janesville close because of the worst recession since the Great Depression, and incompetent GM management. Sometimes I'm amazed at how little the GM "insiders" know about their own industry.

Opinionsforfree: Thanks for the link. I would hope that everybody that cares about our childrens education takes the time to watch the movie. Netflix has it if anybody is interested.

Now, after this JEA-SDoJ agreement was arrived at in good faith, the cry babies come out of the woodwork and whine. I have to ask: When will "you" people realize that "you" made life choices that have let to your earning power (or lack thereof), side benefits { or lack thereof }, quality of life, and yes, ability to retire in a comfortable situation at a desirable time in your life. The foresight of those who chose to become educators...to have prepared well for a rewarding career...and CRITICAL role in society...should be understood and respected.

And, "they" ARE taking their licks: teachers and other staff gone; class offerings eliminated, curtailing professional performance and student opportunity; increased class sizes { non-teachers have little or NO notion of how that changes the classroom dynamics; lost co-curricular assignments { lost pay }; staff transferred to other buildings or assignments. Your ignorance of the teaching field prevents you from truly appreciating the sacrifices that are, in fact, being experienced.

But: Oldtimer is right. UAW's power priced most of us out of the ability to buy their product. Their leadership should have seen that coming. Hubris lead to their demise. Same with the "leaders" of the Parker Pen union, according to my friends who worked there and were in the know. JEA and other locals had better educate themselves to these historical truths. To a real degree, it is happening to you.

realitybites -- the point is that there will be no negotiating. All collective bargaining rights will end June 2013. You cannot call it bargaining when the only thing left for public employees is a cap on wage increases based on inflation. No say about work place conditions, hours, calendar, retirement, type of health insurance, benefit packages. A more accurate description is "begging" for wages, not bargaining. There will be nothing with which to "negotiate."

NVgrf, I worked at the local GM plant here I do know what went on, You are so one sided you dont know right from wrong. The unions do not create jobs. corporations(stock holders) do. We all contributed to GM stock program, so we invested in corporations.

oldtimer.....Wow. I haven't read so much mythology and misinformation in one entry in a long while. It is you who should do some research. You're blaming the wrong people, my friend. You place no blame with corporations? Incredible! How do you feel about the fact that 95% of America's wealth is controlled by 5% of the people? "What, me worry?" Alfred E. Newman

NVgrf, I will tell you why. The local 95 had the same attitude and look at the GM plant here now. The union said "Parker Pen Will never leave Janesville" we dont have Parker anymore. Public education is so bad in this country and why? unions. I belonged to a union in the 40's and there was a need for the union and now it has gone from one extreme to anohter. Jobs overseas etc. The union protects people that dont want to work, drink on the job. Steal. You think this is good? get with it.

The time to negotiate was before the contract was signed. Maybe even while Walker was contemplating his bill. The unions said they would contribute more if collective bargaining was left alone. No one called them on that then. That would be negotiating, I give more money. You leave collective bargaining alone. Granted, the JSD did not have a crystal ball to see the cuts the governors budget was going to do, but he did hint. If I were a teacher, I would want to hear from the school board that perhaps THEY too bear some of the burden for the financial mess they are in and not that it is all the unions fault. Then I would be more willing to talk.

a contract is a contract and the teachers don't need to re-open it for changes. however, I hope the teachers don't expect the school district to do much negotiating on the next contract.

A contract is a contract.

Why, indeed.

I say -- send out more notices of reductions. Let them go and maybe when new employees come in -- they will have a better understanding of the economic conditions. Send a bunch of them packing. Larger class sizes. Eliminate programs. I say make significant cuts.

Theres a documentry called: The Cartel look it up all the prounion teachers and grandstanders for the teachers union. It is chilling to look at the facts that teachers unions are why education is faulturing in this country.

Those who are too lazy to look it up and open there mind.

Here it is http://www.thecartelmovie.com/

I support walkers efforts to strip the union of wasting money and demanding more money for no results

They are being selfish. Everyone is making sacrifices except the teachers union. Shame on them

A deal is a deal. Time to pony up the $55
Janesville taxpayers. I am a Janesville property tax payer.

This is a tough situation.
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I think the teachers would be willing to make *some* consessions. The problem is that the Janesville board is so divided and it's members have demonstrated behavior that makes it VERY difficult for them to be trusted.
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If the contract is reopened, everything is on the table.
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The fact is that there is not enough money. The teachers should make compensation sacrifices to meet the need. But "should" and "shall" are two different terms..

With all that Walker has done and you agree to reopen your contract? Why?

Does this mean that I can't open my contract?