Garyprimer,
You are so very right!!! I am so glad you are not on his bandwagon and can see through the pretty words. I only wish more people did.
Keep putting the word out there!

I am disabled and times are hard. I don't think Obama cares about
the people. He just has pretty words. I feel for the GM employees.
Don't put your trust in him to bail you out. He can not take money
from the troops. They have to be moved out safely along with other
americans there. I only hope people in Wi. will see through him. He Just
wants union backing. Don't think he has any good plan for the people
that really need it. If you think this your are dreaming. Hillary has
experience and I don't care what anyone says about that , my hope
lies with her. Get off this kick about her voting for the war. What would you have done after 911? She voted on the info. she had. LET IT GO! and give her credit for all the good she has done. Think long and hard and if you get the chance ask Obama what his plans are.

I am interested in hearing about Obama's economic recovery plan. I appreciate the fact that he is inspiring, but that doesn't translate into anything substantial. I am fearful that people are choosing Obama because he is charismatic and not because he has a sound plan for improving our country.
Voting with your hearts is good, but use your heads when you do. Okay, you can kill me now.

Just heard Janesville, WI mentioned on CNN about Obama visiting the GM plant. That should put us on the "map" LOL

I saw Barack in Madison at the Kohl Center. I arrived there around 6:30, waited abut 30 minutes to gain entry and luckily found a seat. It was very inspiring and moving. I'm hopeful that Barack will make another appearance in Janesville as hinted at in today's Gazette. He is truly moving when you listen to him.

Who cares!!!

To JanesvilleComments - you are right on the money with your comments about halting illegal immigration. I agree with everything you said (I am waffling on the part about shooting people at the border unless they are drug dealers). I am a Republican who will NOT be voting for John McCain. I am so sick of him and he does not represent me or our party. I would rather see Obama in office than McCain - at this point, I am so disillusioned that no one is listening to the rank and file members of either party.

We must be adults in this matter. It is obious that Obama does not have time to visit with everyone in this town as he is busy with his campaign and time is of the essence. I am sure there will be more time in the future once he gets settled in the White House. He's got his job cut out for him. I can imagine there will be a lot of "house cleaning" to do once Bush and his cohorts are out of town. Healing a nation and the world will not be an easy task, so we need to do our part and be patient and support him and his new administration the best way we can. Go Obama!

Do you people seriously believe that Obama, or any of the other major candidates actually pick and choose where they make campaign appearances?
That's what their campaign stragetists are for. I'm sure it's all figured out by someone analyzing the polls and numbers behind the scene, trying to figure out where appearances would have the most effect.

MrBlack: To paraphrase garyprimer from a different thread to a different poster: zip it. This is an article about Obama, not GM. I think it is nice Senator Obama is coming to Janesville. I do question why he is limiting his viist to just the GM plant/employees. But, let's face it, NO national candidate will ever reach all of the people all of the time. PS--if each GM worker simply screwed a bolt or slapped on a price sticker (or an equally simplistic job), they'd be producing far less than 52 or 44 SUVs a shift!

So is the general public invited to the GM plant to hear him speak?

I'M NOT SURE IF THE "PLANT" IS THE PLACE TO HOLD A TOWN MEETING ESPECIALLY SINCE GM WANTS TO OFFER ALL THEIR WORKING HOURLY EMPLOYEES A PACKAGE TO GET OUT AND THEY CAN HIRE PEOPLE AT HALF OF THE OLD WAGE (WWW.FOXNEWS.COM) .... HMMMMM, SEEMS HE SHOULD BE SOMEWHERE WHERE ALL INTERESTED CAN ATTEND... HOW MANY AT THE PLANT CARE THAT HE WILL BE THERE? JUST WONDERING???

Did I actually see somebody write on here that GM employees work hard?? You have got to be kidding me. Just a bunch of whiney people that think they have it so bad when in reality they get paid top dollar to screw in a bolt or slap a sticker price on a vehicle. I get paid similar money as an IBEW union worker, but I actually earn my money by working hard. There's a reason why GM posted the largest loss ever today, because the UAW drove them into the ground and ruined the company and their own jobs forever. UAW is a disgrace to all union jobs.

Cheesechick:

Time for your civics lesson:

The Electoral College is a constant reminder that government intended to apportion votes in such a way as to protect the interests of less-populous states. We do not now have nor have we ever had a national popular vote for president. We have 51 separate elections in each of the states and the District of Columbia to determine how those Electoral College votes will be cast.

If the nation elected presidents strictly through a direct popular vote, why would a serious candidate waste time and resources in Wisconsin to pick up a few thousand-vote differential when 25 million votes are at stake in New York and California? Without the Electoral College, presidential politics would move sharply to the left as candidates pandered to the political appetites of large liberal voting blocs in the Northeast and California. Perhaps that's why its elimination has been a recurring liberal cause.

Our founding fathers did not believe that men (at the time only men were allowed to vote) were too ignorant or too uneducated to vote.

Janesville Comments:

If raising taxes on corporations is so good-why not raise them from 40% to 90%? If you examine corporate tax rates around the world you would notice that the US tax rates are among the highest in the world. A corporation does not pay taxes-they pass the increases on to consumers who pay more for products or services. WHo gets hurt? The unskilled laborer living paycheck to paycheck. Examine the corporate income tax rates of Ireland vs. France and you will see that Ireland is BOOMING and france (and Germany)are stagnant.

no, they said 14000 but they already let most of the handicaped people in so im guessin it would been hard findin seats

Is that all the Kohl center holds?

i did drive up there and there was a line that they said already had 11000 people in it so they had to open the doors early so i came home

Then go to Madison if you're so passionate about it.

do you know what is funny? you guys are the ones complaining about me complaining and i went to hardvard so im not dumb and i know politics and i just want to see the man im going to vote for for president in real life

"can't you just be happy that he is coming to your hometown and be grateful he saw something here he wanted to see that is pretty special!"
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The sad fact is: somepeople just can't be happy unless they are complaining.

i just want to say how can everyone down GM so much. can't you just be happy that he is coming to your hometown and be grateful he saw something here he wanted to see that is pretty special! there have always been the downers of janesville thinking and waiting to have the local plant close but why?are they just to jealous that they didn't get lucky enough to get a job there really people wake up it is not all sunshine and roses remember 1st grade and having to raise your hand to use the bathroom well guess what that is what it is like at GM they get paid for what they do!! you try being tied to a moving line for 10 hours and chasing a truck sorry i am sure alot people who are complaining could not and would not want to do that

Remember FAIR is a four letter word.

Since when did all of you complainers think life became fair?

Don't be so hard on yourself. At least you are honest. Seriously, I get the point of what you are saying and agree with you on a number of levels, but casting aspersions on the general public is an understandably risky endeavor and one that a reader assumes that the writer excludes himself/herself from. I consider myself a member of the general public and disagree with your assessment. I like GM workers and I like GM. I think that GM is great for Janesville. And puppies, too.

Oh man, it's just too easy. I can't do it.

Yes, Gary. I guess I am too uneducated and too ignorant. That's how I know these things.

Gary are you talking to me?

So you are saying that you are too ignorant and uneducated to make such an important decision. How sad for you. I,too,am a member of the public, but I was fortunate enough to have an excellent education. I guess I am just one of the lucky ones.

Im still going to vote for him and it problly wasnt all his choice just to talk to GM people but im upset because when John Kerry was running for president in 04' i got tickets and waited for 3 hours in beloit but then half the people, including me, had to go home because they gave out to many tickets. So when a presidental canidate comes to janesville and i dont get to see him because i went to college after high school and i dont work at GM then i dont see how that is fair.

This is addressed to all you GM employee haters out there: JFK visited the plant when he was campaigning for president, too. I guess he wasn't for the "little guys" and pandered to GM and the UAW, too. The main reason our democratic voting system includes electoral voting and uses delegates is that the founding fathers of our nation believed that the general public was too ignorant and uneducated to make such a decision for themselves. When people say that they won't vote for a certain candidate based on where s/he holds a rally, or what position s/he has on just one issue, that says to me that the public is still too ignorant and uneducated to make such an important decision.

I agree with the rising tide thing. It is much more appealing to me than the trickle down thing. And much more appealing visually.

So Wilsonzone... he think that the people who are making more money than others should be taxed the same as the people who dont make as much? GM workers arent the only ones working hard in this town so why should they be the only ones to see him? What if someone at GM is a Cliton supporter or even a republician but they are the ones who get to see him and the obama supporters dont??

Taxing corporations more might be a good idea, IF the taxes are on a sliding scale, based upon what percentage of their personnel and facilities are based in America (more domestic, lower taxes - more foreign, higher taxes.

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If Obama wants me to consider voting for him, he needs to have 2 detailed policies he will promise to stick to:

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1. He will only sign a balanced budget. No stealing from Medicate or Social Security, no printing extra cash to make up a shortfall. I don't expect either party to come close to having decent pork-free priorities, but any politician that votes for or signs a budget with a deficit should be voted out of office.

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2. He needs to halt illegal immigration. Punish the employers, deport illegals, build a wall, or shoot them at the border, whatever it takes. This country should only have legal citizens and approved residents. If he wants to come up with a guest worker plan that balances the economic and social costs of allowing guest workers who use our country's infrastructure (hospitals, schools, libraries, public transportation, etc.) that is fine. Just as long as the employees and/or employers pay for the share of the systems they are using.

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There are a host of minor issues being used by all candidates for president to distract the voters from the continual failure of this country's government to correctly handle the above two issues. If the candidates can't handle those, I don't care what their position is on education, abortion, the war in Iraq, etc.

Don't sweat it. If you don't work for GM and weren't invited, there's a good bet you will be the only ones that will still have a job in 4 years after Toyota eats GM's lunch. And B.O. will never be back again. He won't help after he gets what he wants.

I can't believe people would say things like "because Obama is only visiting GM in Janesville, I'm not voting for him," (paraphrased).

Really? This is how you decide how to elect The President of the United States? Obama has visited all over, he's spoken to litte guys and big guys, union and non-union. Guess what? We are a nation of more than 300 million people. He can't visit every town and see every person. He's visiting GM because GM is in trouble now and he intends to offer reassurance (and for the person who didn't want a candidate who spoke to "special interest groups" good luck finding your candidate. He/She doesn't exist. They all speak to special interest groups. And why shouldn't they? Those groups are a large part of the whole).

At least study the issues and the candidates' backgrounds (do some research. Don't just listen to the latest hearsay and rumors). Then make your choice. But don't be a one-issue person. That's how we ended up with Bush (and consequently, ended up in Iraq). There were far too many people voting only one or two issues.

By the way, I've been in union jobs and non-union jobs (presently non-union). I'm largely of the opinion that "a rising tide lifts all boats." (Thanks to JFK for the quote). When the union workers benefit, so do we all.

I guess people who work at GM are the only important ones who live in Janesville.

Stacey,

There are allot of hardworking people that do not have union backing to fight for their pay and benefits. Many more than those that work at GM, Ford and the like.

GM people are doing just fine, yet the company they work for continues to lose money and its ability to compete. There are a number of arguements as to why that would go beyond this forum so I will stop there.

That's not irony.

There are now three separate announcements on this web site that he is coming. Couldn't the initial announcement just be updated when more details come in?
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gary - it appears he will only be talking to GM employees (captive audience?). At this late date, I would be surpised if he visits anywhere else in Wednesday. The security issues must be very complex.

It's ironic people are complaining about Obama visiting an auto plant. Obama has held more and bigger public rallies than any other candidate, and will hold one at Kohl Center in Madison this week. I'd like it if there's a public appearance during his visit, but it might just be briefly at the entrance or something like that. If you really want to see him, go to Madison. Pretty simple.

i think it is great that he is coming to visit GM. they work very hard. i think it is an honor that he would like to see normal everyday hard working people he may have just gotten my vote for this!!!

Sorry Joe.

Who is attending Obama's event? Is it just GM or are local officials invited? Who is important enough to be allowed to see Obama? I guess the rest of us are just Joe Shmoes.

Wrong Down -- I am undecided. But if you read what TCB says you will understand why I hate candidates that pander to specific segments. Pay attention to what Obama says.

He wants to tax corporations more.... What is the impact? Do you think that taxing corporations that already have a difficult time competing will improve their position? Does anyone really believe that protectionist measures will help? What about retaliation from counttries that import American goods? Do we really think that taxing executives more will help when most of the cash sppent in the us comes from the middle class? Who would really pay the price for his ideas.

People get so caught up in the fact that he sounds smart that they pay no attention to the words.

Obama Is a traitor! Its all about GM workers! Not for us "little guys". That to me sways my vote to Clinton! I was undecided, But as of this article saying hes visiting the plant, I just swung my vote! We would never be allowed in there! Its about union only! NOt us non union workers!

Gary:

Obama or any candidate can say that they support GM. What does that mean. A healthy economy benefits most people. I would love to see GM thriving, but the fact is that the Janesville plant is one of the oldest and least efficient plants in the GM system. This is not a shot at the employees.

Obama and Clinton also support restrictive CAFE stanards which directly impact GMs ability to sell Yukons and Suburbans. Do you remember with John Kerry was asked if he owned a Surburban and he backtracked and said "his family owned one-but he didnt? Its his type of phoney pandering that should infuriate dues paying UAW members. This didnt stop the UAW from donating 99% of its PAC funds to democrats and what did the UAW receive? Nothing.

I doubt that Clinton or Obama would insult the UAW like John Kerry did-but lets be honest, Obama's interest in Janesville is less about votes and more about UAW campaign contributions. Obama, HClinton, Bush, Bill Clinton, HW Bush, are all Ivy league educated attorneys (ex GW Bush-Harvard MBA) neither of which has spent any time working on the factory floor.

Yes he is trying to get the vote from GM but with janesville being the biggest city in rock county he should talk to everyone to help him get the votes he needs in this county

You are right, it is not important that he remember Janesville. He isn't coming to see Janesville, he is coming here to say that he supports General Motors and that he is going to save them if they will give him their votes. If he could do that, it would be a great thing for Janesville even though GM is never going to be what it used to be. It will still be a place to work for more than minimum wage. At least I hope it will be.

i was talking about WilsonZone not tcb i agree with what your saying tbc

He's not crazy and i can tell who is supporting Huckabee

NVgrf

Only a fool believes that any Presidential candidate can force private companies to manufacture products in the United States. Isnt it ironic that GM is losing money only in North America? Why do you suppose that is? One reason,is thatGM cannot recover its costs in North America. Why?

"Wanting" is irrelevant. Unlike Gov't businesses have to compete for market share. GM simply cannot tax consumers to raise revenues-Govt on the other hand can create protectionist laws that restrict trade and makes imports more expensive-but who does that hurt? the unskilled laborer who has to pay more for goods produced overseas.

Obama knows that the UAW is sitting on millions of dollars that can be used as soft money contributions (Russ Feingold-and Harry Reid also know this-since you're in NV). Predicatbly, the UAW will endorse the democratic candidate when the nominee has been selected-Obama and Clinton need to pander to local UAWs-this is the way politics work. Its not rocket science.

The UAW has been supporting democratic candidates for decades and what has it received? Massive layoffs, jobs exported to Mexico (and elsewhere), the dues paying UAW rolls have shrunken-all of this while supporting democrats-and yet the US economy continues to grow (although we are in a slow down now), unemployement nationally is at 4.6% (most economists consider this full employment-much better than the Clinton years). The US is a service economy-not a manufacturing economy. Companies will manufacture products where it is cost effective-not cost prohibitive.

Is it good to "want to keep jobs in the US"? Sure-but in practice Gov't is essentially powerless to force companies to "keep jobs in the US"

Who really cares. I would prefer to not see a left wing crazy visit Janesville. Send him to Madison.

I just heard that it wont be open to the public, just to those who work at GM. I think that is a bad idea because if he is hear to talk about middle class familys why would he only talk to GM workers and not have it open to the public??

Gm is the worng place cause it means the rest of us who want to see Senetor Obama cant cause GM wont let just anyone into the plant his visit would be better served if his visit was at the Holiday in express like Presifent Bush did Back in Sept 2004 an the UAW needs to relize they arent the only ones living in the comunitie so if Senetor Obama sees this I hope he reconsider an decides on a more Public Foram an the Holiday inn express is the better choice an will give other people in the cumunity an cahce to here the Senetors message so Please take this to heart an give it serious consideration

Union leaders support democratic candidates because they support unions. Part of campaigning is making stops in as many places as possible. At least Obama is coming to speak to people in smaller towns. This may be partly a photo op, but it's also a chance for him to get his message across. At least he's not going to be trotting out in a codpiece filled flight suit to celebrate a victory that has yet to happen.

I think it is a good thing but is that really going to happen? I think GM is a good place because that's where alot of people in this community work and depending where they set it up at it can hold alot of people who want to see him

TCB.........So it's NOT a good thing to want to keep jobs in the US??!

does it really matter if he remembers janesville, wi? he goes to so many citys and so many states in this country trying to get votes...so i would love if the next president would visit our city so i can say i saw the first black president in history

Garyprimer:
Yes, he wants something, he's coming to Janesville because he wants the UAW vote. He will say how only he will be able to "keep good paying union jobs in the United States."

Its nothing more than politics and union leadership walks in lock step with democrat candidates. This will be great photo op for union leaders. It looks good for Obama-one step ahead of clinton. Its a smart move. Obama has proven himself to be a far better campaigner than Clinton and just might win the nomination. I wonder if Janesville's Klan will protest his appearance?

Does the line at the "plant" stop when Mr. Obama is here? Do the employees still get paid if they leave their job to go hear him? What if I want to see Mr. Obama? We all should have the chance to hear him speak, the "plant" is the wrong location for this visit.

Are you suggesting he should memorize the location of every berg in the nation and visit each on a regular basis if elected?
I am quite sure that when he sees Janesville he will want to buy a home and move right in immediately!

What a great honor for Janesville to be visited by a possible presidential candidate. If he gets elected, I doubt that he will remember where Janesville is. He is coming here because he wants something, not because he wants to help us. If I am wrong, we should be able to call him 6 months from now and he will come back to visit us. It is still nice that he is coming to Janesville.