copperguy i think of the gangs that have these weapons . as you can see sometime i stick my foot in my mouth .

klick: Wish I could claim that as "my line!" All of the agencies I have worked for used either an AR15 or M16, all semi-automatic, meaning one pull of the trigger nets one round fired. I have also shot a 30-30 and 30-06. I found both of those rifles to be as accurate as the AR15/M16.

Without doing some research, I can recall no "mass shooting" in recent history that was carried out in a way that an assault rifle would be more effective than a hunting rifle or handgun. People have been mowed down one-at-a-time, though some in quick succession. That quick succession could be just as easily achieved with a semi-automatic handgun or hunting rifle as with an assault weapon.

Now, if you want to go back to, say, the St. Valetine's Day massacre, then, yes, people were cut down with an atuomatic or machine gun. That's not what a legal AR15, AK47, or M16 is today.

copperguy normaly i agree with you but assault
weapons i think should be banned . to use your line
IMHO

I had a Remington 870 pump and bought a barrel
from gun parts .com. i had the barrel shortened
to use for grouse hunting and i also use it for home protection because you can swing it around easily .

First of all, I concur with many of the things said on this forum. Guns are used by people to kill. Guns are also used for self-protection and recreation. Functionally, there is no difference between an AK47 or AR15 and a semi-automatic handgun. I have never really understood the drive to ban "assault" type weapons. A semi-automatic handgun can be converted to fully automatic just as easily as can an AR15. A 30-30 with a scope is just as accurate (if not more so) than an equally equipped AR15. And, the Constitution does preserve our right to own and bear arms.

Now for the part that will incur the wrath of some of the posters who I have so far agreed with. If you read the by-line of this article, it is from the Associated Press, not Gazette staff. I see absolutely no harm or foul in the Gazette carrying this AP story. Each business owner decides what to sell and to whom. I have seen nothing in this or previous reporting that would amount to "slander" or any other sort of defamation. John Hinckley had an obsession with Jodie Foster. Was the press accused of slamming Foster for covering that aspect of Hinckley's attempted assassination of President Reagan? No.

There is no insinuation in this article that the business owner did anything wrong. It's just one mention with a regional twist. It's a story. Read it or not. Don't make it out to be more than it is.

shopier, yes you can buy guns off the internet. Go to gunbroker.com if you don't believe me. You are correct the story here says accessories. It is legal to buy guns on there though have done several times myself. must still have gun shipped to a dealer and go through background checks and 48 hour waiting though.

Several people on here are talking about this murderer buying his firearm on the internet. He did not buy a firearm on the internet. You can't buy firearms on the internet.

The article never said anything about buying a firearm over the internet. Seriously, some of you should learn to how read before opening your mouths.

I realize people use guns for different reasons. Some for family protection and self-defense. Some for target shooting and some for hunting. All legal and legitimate. They are still designed to kill. A baseball bat can be used for self defense but it is still designed to hit a ball. I have no problem with people having a gun in their homes to protect their families or hunters in general. I think however, to call a gun a "just a tool" is naive. You could probably dig a hole with a .357 magnum but that doesn't make it a shovel.

This guy was on a mission, and he was going to kill people regardless of whether he bought his gun on the internet legally, or on the street out of the trunk of a car. How buying some accessories for your Glock in April of 2008 is correlation to a murder you committed in August of 2009 is unknown to me. I am not sure what is the basis for news is in this story.

We must learn to accept these instances of mass shootings as the price we pay to live in a free society that includes easy access to handguns. As long as unbalanced people with a grievance against something or somebody can grab a gun and squeeze of a few rounds, these episodes will continue. It becomes a numbers game; just hope that you are not in the crowd when the shooting starts.

Guns aren't EVIL! Use a little common sense! PEOPLE are evil. It takes people to shoot guns. Same way MONEY is not EVIL! People are evil. It's how they earn it and the fashion in which they use it that is the issue.

I ahve shot a 10 gauge before and my armpit was bruised from the kickback

Just out of curiosity have any of you ever shot a 10ga shotgun and when you took your shirt off what color was your armpit?

Let's find out where this guy bought gas that day too, and while we're at it, I'm sure he had lunch somewhere, lets find that out as well. After all, we couldn't possibly just accept this incident as a case of a nut job who just went crazy, lets vilify everyone who had contact with this loon for days leading up to this event. Did this guy drive to the health club? If so, where did he get the car? Must be a slow news day or perhaps the Gazette is trying to pander to the anti-gun crowd and manufacture a "controversy" where there isn't one...nah, that couldn't be.

We still have rights??? The only thing banning guns does is gives the bad guys the upper hand cause they don't have to worry about going into your house and getting shot at. Ban my guns???
yeah right........over my DEAD body.

glock21sf
Aug 7, 2009 at 11:06 a.m.
Suggest removal just trying to counter the anti-gunners propaganda. They will say anything to get the sales of guns to be made illegal, even if it means lying and spreading mis-information. I am tired of being villified for being a supporter of our 2nd ammendment rights. They are just as important as all the other constitutional rights.
+
glock21sf constitutional rights what are those we have lost most of them .

guns don't kill people...people kill people. There are plenty of tools that can be used to kill a human being. Firearms are often used simply because they are the most convenient. Stop gun sales all you want and killers will simply move on to the next easiest method. To end killings you need to change the mindset and recognize people that have to "mindset" to kill. I don't understand the anti's mindest. They exepct the govt. to hold their hand and protect them from every risk in their life. Grow a set and do things for yourself and mind your own business! I don't go around asking people why they feel the need to practice their religion of choice, write whatever they feel the need to write, or question them on why they exercise their other civil rights gauranteed by the constitution.So why question my right and choice to own and use firearms? The only reason you have to worry about my ownership of firearms is if you decide to threaten me or the ones I care about in my home. Claim the "militia" line in the constitution means formal military all you want, but it was designed to mean individual ownership. This country won it's freedom from tyranny with the use of a civilian military using the firearms that the people brought to the fight. If you study the constitution you quickly figure out that the rights of the people were to protect the states and the people from a tyrical government and alow them the right and methods to fight an opressive government, even with firearms, if needed. Do the research and you will find it interesting that the cities that have the strictest gun control (chicago, washinton DC) have the highest murder rates and it continues to CLIMB. Taking away guns from LAW ABIDING CITIZENS does not stop crime, it worsens it. It removes the ability of people to protect themselves. The average response time for police IN A CITY is 4-7 minutes minimum. The average violent crime (beating, robbery, rape, etc) is over within 2-5 minutes. If you want the government to hold your hand and expect them to protect you that's fine but don't question my belief that a government agent is not going to be there to help me or my family in time of need or my right to protect myself. As glock pointed out an "assualt weapon" is nothing more than a semi-automatic gun. It just looks different. The handgun that a cop carries on his side and the rifle that I deer hunt with all have the same functionality as the guns that they try to classify as assault weapons: every time you pull the trigger you fire a round. The guy in this story has done nothing wrong. He sells legal accessories and runs a business to make a living. Looking at the size and selection of his web site I would guess he regularly also sells to those PROTECTING lives; cops, military, guards, etc.

He bought "gun parts" from this place so what, it wasn't the gun parts that made this guy go wacko and kill people. I've bought many rifle parts online but they haven't made me do anything illegal. I'm pretty sure by hearing about this guy that he had major problems long before the internet or online buying was even around.

A lot of car dealers sold cars that killed people... should we close them down too? Same argument, just as ridiculous.
.
The "accessories" didn't kill anybody, the idiot behind the trigger did - that is who has sole blame/fault for this tragedy, the perp and NO ONE else...

Good Grief.......I own guns and I'm going out this weekend to look for another one. I'm lucky that my guns are trained not to shoot unless I TELL THEM TO!! Right now all they have done is shred some paper but would have no problem doing more if they "HAD TO". I hope it never comes to that but if it ever did I know it could be done and would be done.

*Why is this even a story?*

No kidding, hey, while we're at it, let's demonize the people who sold him the shoes he wore when he trudged in there to massacre some people.

If the government would only legalize both prostitution AND marijuana then this type of guy wouldn't have any money left over to buy gun accessories with.
☺

people also state guns as being the biggest cause of suicide, but Japan has the highest rate of suicide in the world and there are virtually no guns in Japan.

Some say guns were made to kill, but MORE killing is actually done with motor vehicles than is done with guns(speaking within the USA).
.
Go figure....

12dreams - Many people target shoot with guns and never kill anything. Your statement is not true.
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If guns kill people then pencils misspell words, cars make people drive drunk and spoons make Rosie O' Donnell fat.

Rooster, what because I know about firearms and want to stop inaccurate information I have a brain full of fertilizer??? Please explain. Or do you just want to spread the propaganda as well because you are anti-gun? You can be for or against anything, just don't spread lies about what you are against just to make your view more valid.

Why is this even a story? That's what I was wondering? The store owner did nothing wrong, he sold items that were legal to sell, the media is trying to villianize him by making it look like he sold items illegally, these items listed in the story are not even gun parts, they are parts that sit on your belt and allow you to carry extra magazines (ammunition holders). As to SwissChicks last post, I was not slamming you, I was trying to explain how internet gun sales work so you could see that they are not tying to circumvent any laws by doing sales this way and that they still have to go through Federal back ground checks as anyone else would. As for the AK's that you are against, they look scary, that's why people want them outlawed. They function no differently than any other Semi-automatic hunting rifle out there. pull the trigger and it goes bang once for every time you pull the trigger. They do not go full auto unless you are talking about a fully automatic machine gun, which most people do not own because it costs too much to keep one (taxes). But because the resemble a machine gun people freak out, just like the civilian version of the military m16 rifle called the AR15, they look scary and black, therefore they must be bad! No, they just go bang once every time you pull the trigger, just like a hunting semi-auto rifle.
I did not even point out the typo from earlier. If I wanted to "slam you" I would have brought that up! I was just trying to inform, if you don't want to be enlightened, you have that choice. That's what makes this country the greatest in the world. Peace.

Why is this even a story?

in the famous words of Rodney King : "CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG"

Yeah, I laughed at the typo, too, however, don't think it hasn't crossed my mind.
.
See, I can laugh.

rooster, you made me laugh thanks

Swisschick, I just read these posts from bottom to top, and I thought glock was just explaining not slamming. The typo issue was just people having fun with you.

there are the folks who are expert on guns because they have a cabinet full and there are folks that are expert on fertilizer because they have a brain full.

Three strikes -you R out

First of all, I am never against learning, and, I for one, will admit that I will never know everything about everything. (It would've been nicer to "inform" someone rather than to slam someone).
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I am also not against guns, just some types of guns, such as uzis, AK's, etc. I just don't see the need to own them. (Now before I get slammed again, I know these types of guns were not used in this situation). JMO
.
Now on to my next "enlightening" subject.

SO?

just trying to counter the anti-gunners propaganda. They will say anything to get the sales of guns to be made illegal, even if it means lying and spreading mis-information. I am tired of being villified for being a supporter of our 2nd ammendment rights. They are just as important as all the other constitutional rights.

That is why prostitution needs to be legal, they handle these kind of people, they feel wanted and therefore there is no hate. Let's look at the big picture everyone, he killed because no woman would give him the time.

Sorry I tried to enlighten you on how internet gun sales work, if you would rather not know, that is fine. Just stop talking about stuff you nothing about then. I do know how it works, I never said I know everything about everything. I worked in a gun shop and transferred guns for several people who bought off the internet. It is just as safe if not safer. If you don't want to learn then I feel sorry for you.

my guns are designed to save my life if I or my family are attacked in the middle of the night. None of my guns have killed anything but paper. It is a tool, an inanimate object. It only does what the person behind the trigger plans it to do. Police officers carry guns, are they killers?
Guns are designed for several different purposes. Some are for hunting, some are for self protection, just because criminals decided to use them for killing does not make the guns evil or bad. It is the person who murders that is bad. A car is a tool as well and if it is used to kill on purpose it is no better or different than a gun used for the same purpose.

glock21sf - Good to know that you know everything about anything out there. Peace.

Okay. Small typo at my expense. "GUNS"

Swiss chick, please do your homework. He bought a magazine holder, and other accessories. He did not buy the gun over the internet. That being said, If a person buys a gun over the internet, it is actually SAFER. He has to buy the gun over the internet, then he has to wait for the gun to be shipped to a gun store near him (that's called a transfer), then he has to go to that gun store and fill out all the federal forms just like if he bought the gun from this store from the beginning. He then has to pass the background checks and then wait the 48 hour waiting period, so it actually takes longer to buy the gun over the internet than to just buy it locally, so it has a more than a 48 hour "cooling off" waiting period. you can't just legally buy a gun off the internet and have it shipped to your house. If you don't know how the process works, take the time to learn before you develop a bias against it, that's just ignorant.

You'd think he'd have ads with these celebrity shooter endorsements.

SwissChick writes: I guess I don't believe that you should be able to buy guys over the internet. I think it should always be done in person. Sorry I didn't elaborate.

Correct me if I'm worng, but I think it is illegal to buy "guys" on the internet, not to mention, probably somewhat immoral!

I WOULDN'T. GEEZ. Never mind.

Guns are designed to kill, cars are not.

Why would you buy guys over the internet SwissChick?

Geez, don't have a heart attack. I just don't believe those items should be purchased over the internet. IMO.
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Chill. I know who is ultimately at fault.

I guess I don't believe that you should be able to buy guys over the internet. I think it should always be done in person. Sorry I didn't elaborate.

Hey I heard GM sold a car last year that killed someone when the driver was drunk...guess we should shut down GM too.

Maybe we should shut down every car dealer who sells a car that kills someone!!! Oh my, we also have to shut down all the knife companys who's knives were used to stab someone!!! Give me a break! This gun store is selling products that are legal to own and use. We haven't shut down cigarette companies and they have killed many more people than guns have!!!
It's not his fault these psychos seem to be targeting him now. This guy bought a magazine holder, a piece of plastic molded into a shape. He did not illegally buy a handgun from him. This business has the right to sell shooting supplies to the general public. Every law enforcement officer in the world has this equipment. I have this equipment and I haven't harmed anyone. Perhaps we need to picket Gander Mountain in Janesville, they sell these magazine holders!!! I am just kidding about that! But that is how ridiculous SwissChick is when it comes to this issue, no thought to who is really responsible for this tragedy! Just blame the guy who legally sold the stuff and is legally making a living. I think the pathological thinking of these killers are seeking this shop out on purpose because the media has made him a target by slandering him in the press and on TV after the VT massacre. He did nothing wrong and cannot tell what the motives of his customers are any more than you or I could. Let's just stop selling anything that could remotely be used as a weapon or to carry a weapon! yeah, right.

For what, exactly, SwissChick?

Shut them down.