Freedomfighter,
I'm not sure if anything you said was directed at me. If it was, I will first say, I have said on this very blog that I do not accuse Walker of being Hitler. I do accuse him of behaving like a dictator. Secondly, I linked a poll that does include only the opinions of Wisconsin voters.

I hate to step into this, but does a dictator suspend a constitution, disarm the citizens, create secret police, pit neighbor on neighbor, freeze all wages like Hitler did? My answer is yes, but the Governor will NOT do such a thing. He advocates conceal carry for legal, law abiding citizens and personal responsiblity. From what I have read here and other posts, those who spout this Hitler Walker smut, are afraid to to do things on their own instead of the Govenment doing it or telling them what to do. As for these polls, they are a sham because, which I agree, they do not reflect the citizens of WI and they are stacked by democrats answering the polls. Now everyone can rebut my truths and opinions.

"I would rather they are peaceful but sometimes dire circumstances require resolutions otherwise."

What is so dire here that Walker can not negotiate? Where is the fire? Walker will hold a lighter in the air and say, "There it is!" Then, Walker will threaten to set a house on fire (lay-off public employees) and say that the unions are doing it. Why not just negotiate with your own people?

"I want a new Mercedes, my spouse says we cannot afford a new car. So is my spouse suppose to compromise so I can get a Cadillac?"

What you and your wife do is up to you two. If you really want a new car, but she says no Mercedes, then yeah, she should recognize that maybe there is an option out there you will like. Or maybe you two should compromise on some of your other expenses, if you really want that Mercedes. I saved up four years for mine, and I have one. I would think that, seeing as how you are married, compromise would not be such a new concept to you.

"Your use of dictator reference is not warranted. Write an answer as long winded as you like."

Yes, my use of the word dictator to describe Scott Walker's actions is warranted. I will try to answer you as completely as I can, thanks for the permission.

"Doyle didn't negotiate when it came to 1 billion dollars of tax increases. There wasn't even debate. It was rammed through on party line votes."

And you liken that, to this? The Republicans clearly didn't care, or there would have been debate. No matter how you spin it, it is clear Walker wanted to shove this "repair bill" through before anyone noticed. It didn't work. Why did Doyle's bill get through? Because it was no-where near as controversial, so it passed. One thing is certain. If the Republicans wanted to stop it, Doyle would not have threatened to lay-off thousands of workers until the Republicans unconditionally surrendered.

"Third, I never said Walker campaigned on no compromise. I said his track record is of no compromise and anybody looking at his track record could have recognized that."

True. I'm sorry for accusing you of something you didn't do. I should have re-read your posts before I made the accusation.

"I liked that about him and feel Wisconsin needed somebody like him and his "style.""

So you prefer a dictator? Places like that exist. I accept that you have a different view point than me. I mean that respectfully. I'm not saying I respect that you want a dictator. I know I don't understand how your thought process works, and that's okay. Acceptance of different view points is a good thing, not that you would understand that. It is worth telling you, though, MOST people do not want someone like that in government. You like it now because your ideals and his align. Wait until they don't.

"Fourth, about chaos. Now your really slicing hairs with semantics. "Utter" chaos versus regular chaos?"

Yeah, the degree of chaos is actually crucial. If I pour myself a glass of milk, and I put chocolate mix into it, then stir it, there is chaos in my glass. If I throw it against the wall, there is utter chaos. Significant difference.

"You provide one example of chaos in history and you assume that explains chaos (oops sorry "utter") chaos. Again this is tough. Just because chaos exists, even your "utter" chaos does not mean destruction results."

I chose my words carefully. I dare you to give one example of utter chaos that does not include destruction. Further, I never said utter chaos only produces destruction, but that seems to be how you are choosing to interpret it.

"I support resolutions whether they are peaceful or otherwise."

Actions speak louder than words. You wanted a leader who would not compromise even with his own people.

Your use of dictator reference is not warranted. Write an answer as long winded as you like. Second, Doyle didn't negotiate when it came to 1 billion dollars of tax increases. There wasn't even debate. It was rammed through on party line votes. Too bad the shoe is on the other foot now but some senators are too big of babies to face it. Third, I never said Walker campaigned on no compromise. I said his track record is of no compromise and anybody looking at his track record could have recognized that. I liked that about him and feel Wisconsin needed somebody like him and his "style." Fourth, about chaos. Now your really slicing hairs with semantics. "Utter" chaos versus regular chaos? Whatever. You provide one example of chaos in history and you assume that explains chaos (oops sorry "utter") chaos. Again this is tough. Just because chaos exists, even your "utter" chaos does not mean destruction results. Providing the most extreme example is not sufficient to make your point. Your last point. I support resolutions whether they are peaceful or otherwise. I would rather they are peaceful but sometimes dire circumstances require resolutions otherwise. CPR is violent and painful to the person receiving it, but can be lifesaving. Walker eschewed peace because of the circumstances. I want a new Mercedes, my spouse says we cannot afford a new car. So is my spouse suppose to compromise so I can get a Cadillac?

"Your third point, it is utterly false to say chaos always brings destruction."

What I said was: but it is indisputable that utter chaos will bring destruction and disparity above all else.

Firstly, I said utter chaos. Semantically, there is not a huge difference, but a significant one. Utter means absolute. So, pure chaos. Pure chaos does bring destruction and disparity above all else. Point in case: WWI put Germany into a bind. It allowed for the uprising of the NAZI party, which brought on WWII. With WWII came mass genocide, and eventually, a surrendering Germany, and, eventually, a prosperous nation (West Germany, then just Germany). Yet, while WWI and WWII consequentially did bring about the Germany we have today, we remember WWI most for trench warfare and the first modern use of chemical warfare. We remember WWII (in Europe) for the millions of casualties both on and off the battle field. Good things came out of the wars, but above all else, came destruction and disparity.

"Chaos brings change, new life, and new growth opportunities. Don't be afraid of it, embrace it."

Do you promote chaos over peaceful resolutions? You sound like the type of person who would consider war the first option to resolve a conflict. You sound like the type of person who is completely out of touch with reality.

"So here we go with gov Walker as a dictator despite being elected."

What I said was: The style of no compromise is often embraced by dictatorial styles of governments.

Did I say Walker is a dictator? No. You said he campaigned on no compromise (false, by the way) and I said that is a style dictators EMBRACE.

"dic·ta·tor
   /ˈdɪkteɪtər, dɪkˈteɪtər/ Show Spelled[dik-tey-ter, dik-tey-ter] Show IPA
–noun
1.
a person exercising absolute power, especially a ruler who has absolute, unrestricted control in a government without hereditary succession.
2.
(in ancient Rome) a person invested with supreme authority during a crisis, the regular magistracy being subordinated to him until the crisis was met.
3.
a person who authoritatively prescribes conduct, usage, etc.: a dictator of fashion.

1. You have already said yourself, Republicans took the legislative branch and executive, ergo, he can do what he wants. Essentially, since the Republicans lack the back-bone to do anything but be yes-men/women, he is being unrestricted. Fits the definition.

2. Walker attempts to validate his over-reaching executive authority by placing emphasis on a "budget crisis". Fits the definition.

3. Walker's actions have said, I am Governor, I do not compromise, you will do as I say. Fits the definition.

Am I now claiming that Walker is a dictator? No. There is still the judicial branch to check his power. The 14 Democrats are still checking his power. The voters will recall him (I love democracy), and he will not keep his power. Clearly, he is not a dictator.

Am I still stating that he is acting like a dictator? Absolutely.

"Your second point, no compromise has existed in WI for years. Your point is a double edged sword."

I try to support my claims with evidence. Show me how any of Wisconsin's governors have acted like this in the past, continually (you did say, for years), and I will yield that point to you.

So here we go with gov Walker as a dictator despite being elected. People had ample warning of his style. Period. Your second point, no compromise has existed in WI for years. Your point is a double edged sword. Your third point, it is utterly false to say chaos always brings destruction. Chaos brings change, new life, and new growth opportunities. Don't be afraid of it, embrace it.

"Both of your points are purely your interpretation. In the first paragraph you say "this style" should be embraced. That may be your "style" Kai, but it is not Walker's."

Not only is it my style, but it was clearly the intention of our founding fathers. The style of no compromise is often embraced by dictatorial styles of governments. The Soviets refused to compromise and allow East and West Germany to unite. Kim Jung Il refuses to end it's nuclear arms program or treat its people with dignity. During the French revolution, the aristocrats refused to acknowledge their inhumane treatment of the poor. If Walker does not want to be flexible, then he should not try to be a leader. I have said it before, but it is worth saying again. Governor Walker is the antonym to the saying, "The only thing I know is that I know nothing at all." A wise person recognizes that most things are not absolute, most things are not black and white, and no one person ever holds all the right answers.

" I believe a compromise in this solution is NOT "enriched" whatever that phrase meant."

This could be an effect of your view that only your side is right. If it were a left agenda, you would say it is worthless and there is no way it should be passed. And, you would probably be at least somewhat accurate. From the left's view, then, it could be interpreted that this current proposal is almost worthless. Therefore, by implementing at least some values from the other side, it will become enriched. No one party could run this country and expect great things to come of their agenda exclusively. It takes a collaborative effort to make this country great, even if you yourself can not recognize the value in the ideals of other people.

"I would disagree that it leads to success but it definitely leads to tranquility. Things in WI have been tranquil, no doubt about that. The tranquility created a mess in our finances because the tranquil answer was always tax more."

If your left hand is always fighting your right, you will never get your shoes tied. Utter tranquility may not be productive in some ways, but it is indisputable that utter chaos will bring destruction and dispairity above all else.

Both of your points are purely your interpretation. In the first paragraph you say "this style" should be embraced. That may be your "style" Kai, but it is not Walker's. Many of us like that about him. I believe a compromise in this solution is NOT "enriched" whatever that phrase meant. In the second paragraph you say "compromise is good for long term success and tranquility." I would disagree that it leads to success but it definitely leads to tranquility. Things in WI have been tranquil, no doubt about that. The tranquility created a mess in our finances because the tranquil answer was always tax more. Just because you refuse to admit there is a problem and are tranquil does not make it go away.

"If some voters say "well, I didn't think he was going to do that," well next time clean the stinkin wax out of your ears,"

I whole-heartedly agree. Unfortunately, how things ought to be and reality are often quite different. Our government is set up in such a way that it can be flexible to change, and this style should be embraced. People were sleeping during the mid-terms, but now they have been agitated. Governor Walker should adapt to how the mood has changed, and as a good leader would, conduct himself accordingly. This doesn't mean throw out his entire agenda. This means be open to compromise.

" I still don't think you get the idea that we elected all the conservatives we did so there would be NO compromise. We don't want a watered down solution."

I don't think anyone wants watered down solutions. Rather, we prefer enriched solutions. If you elected an official because you do not want compromise, then you only perpetuate the polarization of our state and of our country. Compromise is not a bad thing, and in fact, is often vital for long-term success and tranquility.

"Kai, I'm afraid I disagree that a leader is supposed to take directions from everybody and compromise on everything."

Tj,
If it sounded like I was saying leaders should compromise on everything, then I am sorry for that miscommunication. I do not think a leader should compromise on everything. That would show an extreme lack of self-confidence, and bring into question why the particular person wanted to be a leader in the first place. However, it becomes necessary as a leader to pick your battles, and to know when to compromise and when not to. I would say a good indication that you should compromise is, if you are splitting your people apart. Governor Walker is only causing tensions in Wisconsin to rise, and regardless of whether or not what he is doing is the right thing, it is absolutely clear that dividing Wisconsin is not the right thing to do.

"Sometimes elected politicians have to make tough unpopular decisions and this takes courage. Compromising on principles would be a poor direction to take."

I agree, sometimes tough decisions are required to be made, and sometimes they are unpopular. Take the war in Iraq for a great example. Even today not everyone agrees that was the right decision for Bush to make, but he had to make a decision. If nothing else, at least Bush was able to make that decision and move on. However, as much courage as it requires to make a tough decision, it takes even more courage to admit when you have made a wrong or bad decision. The difference between this "budget repair" bill and the Iraq war is, we do not have to live with this bill right now. We can still change it to be more proficient. Walker took a big step, and it turns out it that his idea is ripping the state into two. This is not healthy for the state, and it would be amazing if Walker would realize this and offer a compromise that is less upsetting.

That's true Grandys. You know I was talking to a buddy of mine this past weekend who was all fired up about the protests but he actually had no idea that the proposed changes do not affect his union. He had no idea. He only had received and listened to info from his union and they fed him lies which he readily believed. I just think emotion is what most of the protesters are going on, not actual rational thought.

Sarah and Mouse, I would say the union bosses look more like Gadaffi and they are the actual thugs.

grandys618 ..... I think you forgot the explain part. Maybe it's time for you afternoon nap!

http://www.wisconsinjobsnow.org/?gclid=C.........
tj57 so your admitting your support his money grabbing polluters.
Iwould say you are backing the thugs. Carry on tj57.

The man dealt with the loud mouthed thugs on the Milwaukee County board everyday. Do you think a few union protesters will shake him?

Wrong Mouse, he is taking direction from people like myself. Scott Walker is a no nonsense conservative. Wisconsinites had the entire campaign to learn about his history in Milwaukee County where he took on a spendy county board and stymied them at every turn. He does not compromise and gets results. We selected him in the primary because of his uncompromising nature. We want a strong leader who does not give in to Madison as usual. Make no mistake he is doing exactly what voters like myself told him to do. If some voters say "well, I didn't think he was going to do that," well next time clean the stinkin wax out of your ears, get informed and do your homework before you vote. It was crystal clear how he was going to be as governor.

tj57,...... He is taking direction from someone. The very person he thought he was on the phone with is the "manipulator"

There is talk that the Democratic Party is going to change to the Deunion Party! This poll is pure BS! I read the Liberal Politics Daily post that said the exact same thing, but if you read lots of the posts, there is about 85% of the posters AGAINST the Unions..

Kai, I'm afraid I disagree that a leader is supposed to take directions from everybody and compromise on everything. A representative government means somebody that is elected represents you. It does not mean they always agree with you or that they even have to compromise. They have to make their decisions based on their own judgment. We can't expect reps or govs to always check with everybody before they make a decision. Sometimes elected politicians have to make tough unpopular decisions and this takes courage. Compromising on principles would be a poor direction to take. Walker and those of us who voted for him believe collective bargaining is part of the problem. So it needs to go. Federal employees don't have it and they are doing fine. I still don't think you get the idea that we elected all the conservatives we did so there would be NO compromise. We don't want a watered down solution.

This is not a labor/union or private sector " issue". This is a couple of greedy heartless Koch brothers, with a puppet at the podium.
When you coach or watch little kids play sports, try and pick out the union or the private sector. the playing field is equal.
These two adults along with Walker are breaking that American bond.

All of this is a terrible display of the split that has occured within our state and nation. We have becomed a state divided; WE won-YOU lost mentality. Us vs. Them. And it is being spurred on by a divisive governor and legislative body. I agree that a good leader keeps a general perspective but is also open to UNIFICATION if he is a leader in our state or country. We are supposed to be a multi-party nation, so no one group is the WINNER and therfore gets to make all the rules regardless of the other 50%. We are showing the worst side of ourselves much too often in this issue - myself included. It's a sorry, sorry thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kxc6kzH-...

http://www.wisconsinjobsnow.org/?gclid=C...

I am sure of the quality of the people who are for the unions. However, as good as these poeple are, they are being played by something which I think is either a trojan horse or a wolf in sheeps clothing. Besides if everyone truly and deaply educated themselves, there would be considerably less support for these unions.
*
I find it interesting that other polls have shown different results. Lets not forget media and it's reporting tendancies though.
*
If there were no labor unions at all, how could the country not find equality? You hear people say silly stuff like, "They can fire you for any reason!" and "We'll all be working for minimum wage!" YEA RIGHT....play it out. Employers of all kinds would be forced to compete for your work. I DON'T BELIEVE AMERICANS WOULD STAND FOR IT ANYWAY. I wish people would see the bigger picture and stop falling into this like lemmings. Walker is doing the right thing.

I apologize. This is the correct link.

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/P...

tj,
Did you look at the link I posted? That was a survey of voters. They did go and vote. Please understand that regardless of who won, we still SHARE this state. Just because one side won does not mean the other side does not matter. Especially when the numbers were so close. I don't know why it is so difficult for you to understand that.

A good leader is open to suggestions and compromise, and has the ability to recognize that she or he may not always be able to come up with the best solution on his or her own. A good leader values input from those who have staggeringly different views than he or she, because it is those people who can be most critical of the leader's decisions.

Walker fired a shot down range, and there is nothing wrong with that. He made a proposal and it has clearly been shot down. It's time for him to make a wind call (finger in the air), adjust his sights, and fire again. He needs to accept the fact that he mis-judged, and make necessary corrections. He doesn't have to abandon his agenda of fixing the budget, he just needs to refine it.

Maynard,
I didn't typically vote a straight party ticket until I came to the realization that Ryan is just another tool of the Republican vote. I had never voted for him, I had just also never voted against him. I used to like him, back when he was reasonable.

I do agree with you, though. Not any one side alone can make this country great, it takes teamwork and cooperation. In my honest and most objective opinion, that means that even with a majority, you sill have the duty to treat everyone fairly. Most of these people who site the latest election as evidence that only their opinion matters are being every but as selfish and needy as they claim the unions they abhor are.

Kai, Too bad. Those "eligible voters" should have gone to vote. If you want to have a voice you need to go vote. Also, leaders do not wake up in the morning look at polls or see how many protesters are outside their home to decide how to govern. They make decisions and stand by those decisions. Going outside and putting your finger in the air to see which way the wind is blowing is a feeble way to lead.

I would be curious to know how many of the posters here -- for either side --- vote straight party tickets. I have always preferred a national and state government where the legislative and executive branch is not all controlled by the same party --- either republican or democrat. And the judicial branch is supposed to be neutral but does not seem to be at national or state level. I always figured a split government kept the government from doing too much harm.
Too many years of smoke and mirrors from both Thompson and Doyle and robbing Peter to pay Paul coupled with a major recession has now led to a day of reckoning. I hope Govenor Walker does not back down on putting a freeze on collective bargaining for fringes (including pensions and insurance). It is time to pay the Piper. However, I also wish he would drop the provisions allowing voluntary dues, preventing employers from withholding dues, and requiring annual union certification votes. Those 3 particular elements sure look like union busting to me and are likely a large reason he is losing support across the country in the polls. Shared sacrifice is needed --- setting the stage for complete elimination of the union by making it much tougher to get their dues IS NOT. IMHO

Mouse,
I didn't know that there are teachers working for GP?

The margin is wide because a large portion of the people asked were in the unions or had someone in the family in the union. Interesting how figures can be made to reflect what you want to prove your point.

tj,
Not only did I vote, but I also encouraged several others to vote. I guess in your system of numbers, if x > y, then y = 0. Again, many of us do not agree with Walker.

I agree that the vast majority of voters wanted change. I disagree that this is what they had in mind. And to provide some evidence, here is a poll of only Wisconsin tax payers who are also eligible voters.

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/B......

For decades, the collective bargaining process in Wisconsin - favoring unions - has forced taxpayers to shoulder the burden through tax increases and service cuts. Walker's proposed collective bargaining reforms will level the playing field.
-
Why Bargaining Must be Reined In.
http://www.jsonline.com/news/opinion/117...

wando, I understood your comparison. My comment was directed at RAF, not you. I found it difficult (and still do) to believe he couldn't see your point.

"much of the state does not agree with Walker's ideas." Then vote. Those of us who voted for Walker knew exactly where he was going. Not only did Walker win but just about every conservative candidate won. So its not just Walker but also the assembly and the senate went conservative. Pretty clear message to union loving liberals that we the people of Wisconsin want a clear change of direction. We elected that many conservatives because we don't want the same tired old Wisconsin garbage we have had in the past. Wisconsin clearly voted for NO COMPROMISE.

To all who say the most important poll was Nov. 2, I would like to remind you of the quantitative results, and their relation to the quality of Wisconsin. 1.1 million votes for Walker, 1 million for Tom Barrett. Walker won, but much of the state does not agree with Walker's ideas. Since Walker won, his ideas are presented, not Barrett's. However, consideration must sill be taken for the other majority of Wisconsin. Thus, we come to a COMPROMISE on Walker's ideas.

Let's see if the "Billionaire Koch Brothers" want to donate to pay towards the so called "debt" !

grandys618
Mar 1, 2011 at 11:25 a.m.
Suggest removal
I could care less what the rest of the country thinks, unless they want to start paying some of Wisconsin's debt off.
......Walker made sure that's not going to happen now.

Wow, sigma - take a statistics class. It is called a sample. Margin of error decreases with increased sample size, but a sample of around 1000 for a survey is actually quite large.

@nomoreres: It was in reference to RetiredAirForce suggestion about paranoid conspiracies. The story supports the theory that Walker has a history of union busting and that's what he's trying to do now.

wando what does this story have to do with affairs in milwaukee county?
RAF, apparently I've been giving you too much credit for being somewhat objective in your analysis of Walker's bill over the course of the last several weeks. If you seriously don't see the common denominator in these scenarios then I must conclude that you are totally biased. Tell me that you just missed it this time so I needn't disregard all of your other arguments (some of which I thought had substance until now).

http://interested-party.blogspot.com/201......
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kevin-gran......
Talk about misuse of office or board. The very reason Walker is put into office. To create delays, and designate to Koch and other National violators.
You can come onto the Gazette and pick on each other at the penny level, but look at the big piicture. This is the country your parents and grandparents fought for. They did not give blood for the Walker and Koch
foundation.

cynicaleye, the only one spewing hatred is the teachers and the unions. Walker is trying to save our state and really, the teachers too! I personally don't care what unions representatives in other states think. Wisconsin voters want walker, and we are getting what the people want

It is interesting how the different polls get different results. Is is that the questions are asked in a way that skews the answers in favor of the desired result. The last poll I saw of Wisconsin residents placed the numbers at 71% in favor of eliminating collective bargaining. This stands in stark contrast to the poll referenced in this article. Maybe the Gazette should be a little less one sided and put the numbers from multiple polls in the article.

RetiredAirForce: You're the one that mentioned paranoid conspiracies. The story definitely supports the theory that Walker has no regard for laws and policies. He declared a budget emergency in Milwaukee County so he could fire the security guards, which turned out to be illegal. He is doing the same thing as governor. He is declaring a budget crisis to try and spin things in his direction; there is no budget crisis. The whole deal with the state losing $165 million if it doesn't refinance is a load of crap. He is trying to push off a May 1st payment and isn't even refinancing at a lower rate. Refinancing will in fact cost the state another $42 million.

So we want to talk polls and numbers......Koch Industries, a large chemical manufacturer and one of Inhofe's biggest campaign contributors, gave Inhofe $6,000 that year. That same year Koch bought two pulp mills from Georgia-Pacific, a major formaldehyde producer and one of the world's largest plywood manufacturers. The next year Koch bought all of Georgia-Pacific.

The "more robust" findings that Inhofe asked for weren't released until five years later – in May 2009 – and they reinforced the 2004 findings. Of the nearly 25,000 workers the National Cancer Institute had tracked for 30 years, those exposed to higher amounts of formaldehyde had a 37 percent greater risk of death from blood and lymphatic cancers and a 78 percent greater risk of leukemia than those exposed to lower amounts.
Kids... private sector, policemen, firefighter, teachers..........
Walker if he was for the people should not have used blood money for his campaign.
You are all at his mercy.

Why does Scott Walker and Wisconsin Republicans hate teachers and public employees?

The Gazette poll February 17th should be mostly Wisconsinites.
If you extrapolate the Gazette poll “in regard to Walkers budget bill”, the "right choice, right track" is 46%, and the "made a mistake, reinforces my decision" is 50%. That would indicate that a few more people are in favor of unions/collective bargaining than are for getting rid of unions/bargaining rights. This was 11,000 total votes, so it is a huge sampling compared to population in this area. Without voter ID who knows how many times the same people voted, so it could just be trash numbers.

I copy and pasted the wrong population for Wi.... its actually 5,654,774. oops. Anyway... same point.

"People find unions effective, people find government necessary and effective."

What you failed to mention is "people also find unions ineffective, people find government necessary but ineffective."

A poll is worthless and meaninless. It speaks for 1000 people, and WI is made up of 307,006,550 people (census 2009). So no matter what percentage of that 1000... Its like saying 100 out of 1000 people are addicted to internet porn... so that means by this poll's logic that 30,700,655 in WI are adicted to internet porn also. So stupid.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kevin-gran...

wando what does this story have to do with affairs in milwaukee county?

http://interested-party.blogspot.com/201......
CLICK ON THE BLUE WORD FORMALDEHYDE then you might like a tripto Cali with Walker.

wando please show which federal position that can collectively bargain for a wage increase, via the union. Please show which employee in the 13 states without collective bargaining can negotiate for a wage increase, via the union.

I love how they look at this as "Americans", but there is no poll out there of WI citizens (that I know of). Isn't that the one that ultimately matters to us? I think it is funny how people from other states make judgements based on only what they here in the news. It would be nice to take a poll from the educated citizens (educated about this bill) of Wisconsin to see what they have to say. I think that poll would show a much closer margin swinging towards Gov Walkers plan. I know some will not agree, but that is what I think.

@RetiredAirForce...read the link

http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/1...

sound familiar?

(David) Koch sits on the advisory board of the National Cancer Institute—a position he was appointed to in 2004 by President Bush. the National Cancer Institute had also performed a preliminary study that linked formaldehyde to leukemia, but members of Congress including Sens. James Inhofe, R-Okla., and David Vitter, R-La., managed to delay the EPA from officially designating the chemical as a “known carcinogen.” In 2005, Koch Industries bought Georgia-Pacific, one of the world’s largest plywood manufacturers and a major formaldehyde producer. The company has donated to both Vitter and Inhofe.
(David) Koch sits on the advisory board of the National Cancer Institute—a position he was appointed to in 2004 by President Bush. the National Cancer Institute had also performed a preliminary study that linked formaldehyde to leukemia, but members of Congress including Sens. James Inhofe, R-Okla., and David Vitter, R-La., managed to delay the EPA from officially designating the chemical as a “known carcinogen.” In 2005, Koch Industries bought Georgia-Pacific, one of the world’s largest plywood manufacturers and a major formaldehyde producer. The company has donated to both Vitter and Inhofe.
NOW READ THIS BEFORE YOU START YOUR USUAL BLOGGING.
ASK A SCHOOL KID TO READ IT..... YOUR KIDS OR GRAND KIDS.
START TO REALIZE WHAT "Walker and Koch" will do with all of you. You or your families mean nothing to them.

mgcarguy please tell me what benefits that would be?

Let's see a poll of ALL TAXPAYING Wisconsin citizens on where they stand on public employee unions once they really understand what they are costing every one us. They are a huge conflict of interest and this nonsense must end. Only 1,009 adults were polled? Please. tj57 nailed it. The most important poll happened on November 2nd and the silent majority spoke loud and clear. The number of unions is shrinking and there is a good reason for it. It is time for Wisconsin to be a Right to Work state and bring jobs in instead of watching more of them leave. The economic survival of the state of Wisconsin is at stake. I am behind you 100% Governor Walker. Stand strong and don't back down. The taxpayers footing this bill are counting on you!

janesvillean did you forget some of your own wild conspiracy triads, "I see the governor creating a crisis situation so that he can pass a bill that massively destroys state government and statewide local finances, all to destroy the unions he obviously hates. That is very, very wrong."

If removing partial collective bargaining destroyed governments how are the other states and the federal government still in operation that don't allow the same?

As I said, don't let the facts get in the way of all the paranoid, in your case tin foil hat, conspiracies.

The Pew Research Center? I only go by two, Gallup, and Rasmussen. Those are the only two I trust. Rasmussen is right on the past two elections. I don't bother what R or D's believe, I look at the independents. The independents are against eliminating collective bargaining for public employees 62% to 31%. National polls on same question 61% to 33% Gallup Governor Walker wins on all other issues.

http://interested-party.blogspot.com/201...

I would bet good old retired air force would enjoy giving up his benefits.

984 Adults is less then .000005 of the population. Hardly enough to make any claim either way

@RetiredAirForce...Please enlighten us, what are all of these collective bargaining rights that public employees will retain?

the margin is so wide even raf could fly through it.

The most important poll happened November 2nd.

Nobody's bringing up paranoid conspiracies but you, sky jockey.

Too bad most of these people are not aware Wisconsin public employees will stall have more collective bargaining rights than many other states and all federal employees...but don't let the facts get in the way of all the paranoid conspiracies.