andre; They will never believe it - you could run this on MSNBC 24/7 & they still wouldnt - Besides, everyone KNOWS FOX News made this clip - right Darwin?!!!!

As interesting as andrelinogue and Badgerlvrs arguments are, I'm pretty sure that no one, besides the two of you, are interested in knowing who of you has a stronger handle on history. That's not what this thread is about...
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When reviewing the posts on this thread, one will see that they become increasingly bipartisan, argumentative, and insulting. During the last two days, not one post has added any value to the various subjects being debated regarding Ted Kennedy's legacy, or his health care initiative. In case you missed it, Mr. Eyster posted a previous blog: "After All, The Truth Is Neither Democratic Or Republican..." Maybe it would serve the majority of posters here to review that thread.
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Yes, Ted Kennedy's role in Mary Jo Kopenche's death is disgusting, no one is going to disagree with that. Trivializing the impact he's had on society does a disservice to everyone on this thread, though.
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DiGriz...I'm pretty sure that it was the actual VOTES that kept him in power...that's what it comes down to on election day. People casting their votes. The reasons that you offer up as the incentives people had for voting for him are just that...YOURS. Not mine, and certainly not facts. Your opinions. They're fine and dandy, but don't go confusing them with facts, as there are many politicians with money, a lot of money. Money doesn't necessarily = votes...look at Bush 1 if you need proof of that.

Andre...please explain to me the role that Congress played in getting us into the war in Iraq.

andre_linogue:
If you recall my first blog (of which you were insulted), I said that blaming the Democratic party for any war was similar to blaming the Republican party for the swine flu pandemic. I believe you know that the President can declare war, BUT Congress has to approve it. Woodrow Wilson (WWI) was a Democrat but had both the Senate and H.O.R. as Republican majorities. (66th Congress). FDR (Democrat) had both the House and Senate as Democrats but you certainly can't blame the Democratic party for the U.S. involvement in WWII. *Remember Pearl Harbor? As for Truman (Democrat), he also had the supportive Senate/H.O.R. (Democrats), but can you blame the party for the invasion of S. Korea by N.Korea? Eisenhower (Republican) took over and was supported by Republican majorities in both the House and Senate. It still took two years to stop the war. As for LBJ (Democrat) and the 75th Congress, he also had Democratic support. Out of the above, LBJ's tenure was responsible for getting us into Vietnam, but you can't even begin to say that Nixon got us out..."with honor" as he promised. We ALL know what an honest man he was. I was trying to say that "no one party" is completely responsible for getting our country into war. You obviously believe otherwise. I hope this clears up what I was trying to convey to you. As for the name calling, I apologize, but it seems to have gone both ways.

andre_linogue: How can one lose an argument when one of the combatants has a closed mind, mainly you. I'll put my educational resume up against yours ANY TIME...loser!

Edward "Ted" Kennedy died during the night! - is that exciting news? Why the exclamation point? I guess one less liberal in the world who says one thing and does another is exciting... I wonder if the band "the dead kennedys" will be performing at the funeral?

andre_linogue: There's no sense in trying to discuss anything with you. You're too set in your ways to know that "neither political party" is responsible for anything that goes on in this country. Both are responsible. Where'd you get your G.E.D.?

SuperDave-well said- I couldnt agree more.

And BTW, Eyster writes like a fifth grader (no offense to fifth graders).

An end of an era. The last Kennedy, and the only one of the four brothers to die from natural causes. Condolences to the family. All that being said, this person was a trust fund baby (the trust fund being the result of years of running illegal booze during Prohibition), who just luuuved to give away money...not his own of course, but other people's money. I think we should all respect the recently deceased, but at the same time let's not turn this person into something he was not. A legend, a hero, a man of principle? Hardly. Others have stated what this man truly was at his core, I will not repeat it but I do agree. Goodbye Ted.

andrea_linogue: Gee, I didn't know Hitler, Mussolini and Tojo were Democrats. I always thought Korea was during Eisenhower's reign ('52-'54). Thanks for the history lesson.

916wi , I don't think any one on this blog 'idolizes' him, its called respect for someone who passed away. If I had been old enough at the time of mary jo's death to know what was going on , my condolences would have gone out to her family as well.

andre_linogue: Your post is laughable at best. Blaming ALL Democrats for every war possible makes as much sense as blaming ALL Republicans for the swine flu pandemic. What planet are you from?

xpvega is absolutely correct! An inalienable human right could be anything and everything one enjoys as the sole inhabitant of a deserted island. Genuine human rights must never abrogate the rights of others nor must they depend on the fruits of another person's labors in order to be exercised.

When two people inhabit that island, such rights as life, liberty, speech, religion, pursuit of happiness, etc., can be equally enjoyed by each because neither need nullify any rights of the other in order to freely exercise their own. This is an axiom: genuine human rights are always equally and simultaneously applicable to everyone.

So, what happens under Mr Eyster's definition of "RIGHT" when one of the two island dwellers needs 24/7 medical care and the other is a physician? Does the former have the "RIGHT" to enslave the latter in order to exercise his so-called "RIGHT" to healthcare? Moreover, how is the physician ever able to exercise her so-called "RIGHT" to healthcare?

Obvious and blatant inequality is the telltale attribute of any manufactured "RIGHT". To include healthcare among the list of genuine, inalienable human rights is not a debatable statement of opinion. It is evidence of a SEVERELY DISORDERED THOUGHT PROCESS.

Curtaincall......I have just about as much respect for this man as he did for the drowning woman he walked away from to let die.......which is somewhere around none......I'll tell you what is embarrassing to me....The fact that some people idolize this man as someone to look up to and strive to be like......Sorry--I think I'll pass:)

I wonder what will be said about some of you when you are gone. He was a great man, and a great leader, and accomplished many things. He would not have gotten reelected if he did not.

What is embarrassing is some of you on here who have no respect for those who have passed on. I am sure hannah is on here, under a new handle. As she loves to bash the dead.

Court is now in session. Mary Jo Kopechne’s testimony will finally be heard.

look what else Massachusetts did - passed state run health care - guess what, thats not working out very well either.

The rednecks on this site are enough to make you puke. They have no respect for any great American leader. They would have mocked Jefferson.

anotheropinion -

I couldn't have said it better myself. Why is it because he is now dead, that everyone has forgotten that he was a miserable excuse for a human being and that he allowed a young woman to die without any consequences. He was dishonest, a drunk and a womanizer and sacrificed an innocent young woman for his political career. The state of Massachusetts should be ashamed of themselves for continuing to re-elect him to the Senate over and over. I guess they just wanted a Kennedy and didn't care if he was a lying, cheating, irresponsible drunk. I know I won't miss him!

I am glad so many remember Chappaquiddick, which is Edward Moore Kennedy’s true legacy; not the myth the media is perpetrating. He was an academic fraud (cheating at Harvard) and drunken philanderer with no respect for women.

He was guilty, at the very least of negligence, possibly manslaughter, in the death of Mary Jo Kopechne.

Hope you found absolution at the end Teddy; history will not be so forgiving.

Here we go again with the free health care for all thing again. Keep making promises from government and watch us go broke and wind up with Cuban style health care (of course that is glorious to Michael Moore and the far left). For an intelligent view on health care research articles by the CEO of Whole Foods. Mr E and the Obama administration seem to feel that government will guarantee us immortality and health care to the max without cost. I am all for health care reform but it must involve individual responsibitly and a consumer mentality. It should be purchased the same way we buy a car.

Mark Twain...Wait until history takes toll of how many people Bush and Cheney killed with their wars. Kennedy's was an accident. Theirs were matters of intent.

Thanks for owning up to the error, John. Most of the time the Gazette merely changes errors and makes the folks who pointed them out look like fools.

Hardly someone to admire......I think I'm going to take a pass on trusting the judgment of a man who walks away and leaves a woman to drown. Socialized health care is a joke--it is so refreshing to see the American people take a stand against having it railroaded through Congress. I have always believed in the idea of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"......not the guarantee or entitlement of anything. There should be equal rights and equal opportunity for everyone--however that doesn't translate to an equal outcome or equal entitlement for everyone. Those that are unable or incapable of providing for themselves should be helped to an extent, but those unwilling to provide for themselves shouldn't have a dime of my money wasted on them.....A final thought--The only thing that the illegals should be given, or have a right to, is a bus ride back to the country they came from...Thanks for listening:)

In case anyone is interested:
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Listening Session with Congressman PAUL RYAN
Today @ 3:30 Craig High School.
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Sorry for short notice...hopefully this will help shed some light on this confusing topic. Hope to see you all there.

DiGriz: I think it would serve you well to remember that it was the American People (whom you claim he did not serve) that kept him in office all of these years...

lakennedy; you are correct, I should & try to work on that. The sarcasm tends to run a little deep when I get going - for that I am sorry if I offended you or insulted you - not Darwin though, see there I go again.

Ted Kennedy was an eloquent speaker, and he did eloquently speak to the basic principal that if our Declaration of Independence is to mean anything, every American has the right to health care. Your dream lives on, Teddy. God bless you.

That "cowardly behavior" that you descibed would have prevented anyone without the last name of Kennedy from holding ANY political office. If anyone would do any REAL, UNBAISED research on the Kennedys and their beginnings, the romance of Camelot would greatly be diminished. I believe that this family has contributed, however slightly, to the lack of morality in this country. As far as "Teddy" serving the public interests, he was at the public trough longer than most of the rest of them taking above average pay with above average insurance with above average perks. Who wouldn't want the job. He was nothing more, in my view, than a CAREER POLITICIAN. Something we have way too many of!

I've never indicated what I agree with, certainly not the bills as they currently stand. While the example I previously offered did pertain to seniors, I can offer twice as many examples of cases where the current system is failing youger citizens. I do agree we need insurance regulation.
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I think you have some excellent points, but I do disagree with a few of them...I also think that you would do well not to insult people who disagree with you. Your statement: "Take 2 aspirin, wash it down with some more Kool-Aide and call me in the morning." Is not only presumptuous, it's insulting to me and this thread. Why would anyone want to debate anything with you when you resort to statements such as this? You seem to have excellent counter-arguments to those who disagree with you, and I think that you have a lot to share, but resorting to statements such as that closes the door to any thoughtful debate. Please try to work on that.

lakennedy; I guess we can agree on 1 thing: the current system is broke - but how to fix it is where we disagree. Have you read the bills? that's exactly what they will eventually do is take over the entire system. Single payer is the ultimate goal.
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How about the dozens of retirees I know who have worked their entire lives, only to retire into a system that not only fails to cover their most basic needs, but drains them financially? - wait a minute, I thought this was about "insuring the 46 million Americans that dont have health insurance" Obama has been saying for weeks/months - that Medicare wouldn't change under this plan. What your saying is Medicare (for your retired friends) is broke - which is it? If its Medicare, then lets fix it NOT reinvent the wheel - we need Term Limits, TORT reform & Insurance regulation NOT this. Take 2 aspirin, wash it down with some more Kool-Aide and call me in the morning.

Besides, if he was only a "rich, pampered playboy," then why would he want to spend his life in the Senate, where he's constantly subjected to media/public scrutiny? He devoted over half of his life to serving the U.S..

Mark Twain: That's not all he was, and to trivialize his service to our country in that manner is assinine. If the voters of Massachusetts shared your sentiments, they wouldn't have voted him back into office over and over again. Show a little respect. His role in Mary Jo Kopechne's death is disgusting, but it's not fair to summarize his entire life by that one mistake.

Furthermore, I never suggested that the "entire system" be taken over, which is absurd. But not as absurd as continuing down the same path we've been on.

How about the dozens of retirees I know who have worked their entire lives, only to retire into a system that not only fails to cover their most basic needs, but drains them financially?
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The founders also never implemented a system to pay teachers, police officers, etc. The beauty behind the infrastructure of our government is that it has the flexibility to change as our society's needs do.

lakennedy; its also absurd to read into the Declaration of Independence that health care is an unalienable right. Although health care as we know it today & insurance did not exist when they wrote this, were there not doctors & health care to a degree? If our founding fathers really thought this were an unalienable right, wouldnt they have at the very least, set up a "system" to pay the doctors for our ailments?

The problem is that millions of Americans have EARNED health insurance, and aren't covered...there is no denying that...really?! what did they do to "earn" it - perhaps you think its a born right to passage to receive health care. I agree with you if your refering to the one's that can pay for it yet are denied coverage by the ins. co's. Thats where reform & regulation comes in to play, NOT takeover of the entire system - which is really absurd.

Though he contributed much, let us round out the story of Senator Kennedy. Upon the collapse of the Soviet Union, for purely political reasons and motives, Senator Kennedy colluded with and encouraged the Soviets to block President Reagan's arms control proposals. (See the article by Bill Gertz & Joyce Price, "Soviet files reveal Kennedy sought KGB help vs. Reagan, Washington Times, Feb. 15, 1992, at A3-- as cited by Judge Laurence Silberman in the Harvard Journal of Law and Public Policy Vol.32, No. 2 at Pg. 509, Fn.11 2009). One may forgive Chappaquidick and Palm Beach, but colluding with the Soviets and KGB, that was an act of treason.

SPECIAL THANKS to "NVgrf" for alerting me to having the WRONG YEAR... it was November 22, 1963. I do appreciate readers who alert me to errors/corrections! Here we go... Mr. E.

Thanks for a great blog, Mr. E ! Senator Kennedy was truly a champion for legislation that would benefit ALL. He was a statesman, a consensus-builder and worked hard for the causes he truly believed in. I agree that a memorial of healthcare for all would be most fitting. RIP, Senator. Thank you for a lifetime of commitment and hard work for US.

Comparing the difficulty in securing adequate health care insurance to the difficulty of securing groceries is absurd...at best. You do a disservice to yourselve and this thread when you write such things.
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The problem is that millions of Americans have EARNED health insurance, and aren't covered...there is no denying that...

I did a little research and November 22 was the date that always appears. Wrong?

John. You might want to rethink your JFK assassination date. I think your shift to the right might be playing tricks with your memory.

xpvega; I agree, some things are just earned. Using Mr.E's logic (and of course Darwin's) - I should be on my way to Woodmans right now to stock up on free food (which by the way is ESSENTIAL for humans to live). Free food is not a "right" just like health care is not a "right". I (we) all have access to food - we just have to pay for it and IF we qualify, yes, we can actually get "free food" - its called food stamps - but its not just given to everyone as a "right" - the same should go for health care - IF you (or I) qualify then certain procedures/test etc. should be "given" and just like food stamps - you should only be able "buy" certain items on assistance.

xpvega,
I sincerely hope you still feel that way when, at some point in your life, you find yourself drawing the short stick of life and existence. Perhaps someday, if you find yourself needing an expensive medication to manage a debilitating disease, but you have no insurance and are unable to afford any, you will see things from a different perspective.

A "right" is something every human has simply because s/he has been born. No one has a right to something that is produced by someone else. Such an "right" requires the violation of someone else's right.

Thus - there is no such thing as a "right" to health care just as there is no such thing as a "right to a job", or a right to a home, or food or any such thing. Those are all things that must be earned.